We have had the same issues, a LB purchase came to us just after purchase and required quite a lot of work incl tuning. The videos often run through the scales very quickly so you miss what may be an issue.
Liberty bellows prices, honest? Fair?
- Thread starter Jaime_Dergut
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That is quite common with videos of people showing their accordion is in "good as new" condition. Some people even just show that everything plays well on the tremolo register (MM), perhaps because that's all they ever use.
The sad reality is that whether you buy an accordion from a private individual, a music shop, or even an accordion dealer, it likely needs work and always requires at least tuning. And when an accordion you buy from an accordion dealer needs tuning it is also a hint that maybe the dealer doesn't know how to tune an accordion properly, so it's best to avoid that dealer altogether.
breezybellows
Well-known member
I've purchased 4 accordions from them. All of those were in great condition. I didn't think any restoration was fine in those accordions because they were in good shape. My acquaintances have had bad experiences with them. My guess is that if the accordion already has problems in it they don't do a lot to restore the accordion to a good shape.
TimeSwan
Member
Accordions are not cheap instruments. Even cheap ones are not cheap. If you manage to get a decent brand for a few hundred dollars or less that is playable, you won the lotto as far as I'm concerned. Take into account the limitations of where you can purchase a WORKING accordion and it becomes a supply issue.
When I worked at LB, there were 9 other employees, that's a lot of overhead in payroll alone. There are also two other factors that afford LB they're prices: every instrument sold has a repair warranty and the fact that it is a proper brick and mortar (say what you will about that but it adds a certain level of legitimacy to the establishment that someone like myself, working out of my house, has to work a little harder to earn).
When I worked at LB, there were 9 other employees, that's a lot of overhead in payroll alone. There are also two other factors that afford LB they're prices: every instrument sold has a repair warranty and the fact that it is a proper brick and mortar (say what you will about that but it adds a certain level of legitimacy to the establishment that someone like myself, working out of my house, has to work a little harder to earn).
Amen!
I don't know how Mike does it -- to make a profit with all of his overhead. He has to make a profit, but with all his expenses, I don't think his prices are extremely high. You will find the same accordion at a cheaper price -- I don't know what support you can get after the sale. As I have mentioned before, I bought 3 accordions from Mike - 2 Roland FR- 8x's and an "ACE". They all arrived in perfect condition -- the 8X's were mint. The ACE, he said was "well worn" but was basically in good condition. He played/tested it while I was on the phone with him. He said, it had a few tuning issues and would take care of them. He did, shipped it to me, and it arrived in perfect condition from being shipped -- LB bellow's packing is great. I play the ACE today and the tuning is like the day I received it from LB. I'm sure, with Mike's volume of business, and the large staff he has, he cannot personally check every accordion that he sells -- and employees make unintentional mistakes. However, if you purchase an accordion from him, and something is wrong, call LB and Mike will make it right.
Xiane
Active member
This is an odd thread, but perhaps I could add one thing that might be helpful.
"Speaking Ones' Mind" is fine, you can do it in the US. But you should know that if you make false and damaging statements and present them as fact to others, and it causes harm (or in some cases foreseeable harm), that's legally actionable against you.
Rudy Guiliani didn't lose bigly in court for "speaking his mind" he lost because he made false claims, as fact, not opinion, that caused harm.
Freedom of speech isn't freedom from all consequences of that speech. There are broad protections of speech in all its forms, but there are exceptions, and slanderous, or libelous statements are among them.
"Speaking Ones' Mind" is fine, you can do it in the US. But you should know that if you make false and damaging statements and present them as fact to others, and it causes harm (or in some cases foreseeable harm), that's legally actionable against you.
Rudy Guiliani didn't lose bigly in court for "speaking his mind" he lost because he made false claims, as fact, not opinion, that caused harm.
Freedom of speech isn't freedom from all consequences of that speech. There are broad protections of speech in all its forms, but there are exceptions, and slanderous, or libelous statements are among them.
Squeezeplay
Active member
I bought two accordions from them over the years.. They have been totally honest and up front with me.
If I was looking for another box, they would be my first choice......If you read my post from earlier today, you would know my second.
If I was looking for another box, they would be my first choice......If you read my post from earlier today, you would know my second.
Liberty Bellows is a great company. I believe their prices are reasonable--Yes, you can find an identical accordion at a cheaper price (and also the same one at a higher price). However, the service, customer satisfaction. that Mike, the owner, wants to deliver is outstanding.
I've seen plenty of accordions bought for exorbitant prices from supposedly reputable dealers that were total junk - leathers curled, reeds covered in rust, leaking air. It's disheartening what people think they can get away with. Personally, I won't sell anything that I wouldn't want to play myself. This often means putting 40-60 hours of work into an accordion before selling it. This is probably why I rarely have them available for sale.
I'm all in on the "honesty" bit. I don't sell accordions but only play and do repairs. When I get an accordion in for repairs I always give the "customer" (It's volunteer work actually) my honest opinion about their accordion. That is sometimes pretty bad news, like very shoddy construction, rusted reeds, reeds that don't produce a stable frequency (despite being centered and voiced properly and having good valves)...
Sometimes the situation is simply sad, like a once expensive accordion with convertor (and cassotto) that has rusted severely reeds and an owner who cannot afford (or doesn't want to spend the money) to have the reeds replaced by new ones... People sometimes think a repairer can take a junker and deliver an accordion that's good as new for little money... Sadly that doesn't work. (And I don't actually tend to do very large jobs like replacing all the reeds, which is better done at the factory if it still exists.)
With regard to "better done", there are also private repairers that are retired factory workers (getting fewer, though). My last such resource was incredibly fast and consequently quite cost-effective. While the quality of non-professionals can be quite good as well, there is a difference in speed and routine between people who do a handful of instruments a year and those who have worked under time and competitive pressure on hundreds per year for decades. For a tuning job, this repairer used a tuner (or other reference) once: for tuning the reference note. All the rest went by ear. Somewhat unusual to me was that he did not take tremolo depth in cents but by description. And if it ended up other than you wanted it, he'd spent an hour (on a 41-note instrument) to adjust it, letting it settle for 3 days and then retouching it.
And the results were quite more consistent and agreeable (not just on the tremolo) than a previous tuner spending weeks on it with the most expensive Peterson tuners. Which are quite good but show notes in isolation rather than in relation to those notes it has "beating relations" with. Tuning by ear works with those relations that are most prominent when, well, listening by ear. So if you have the hearing and the training and the concentration, you can rather effectively work where it counts.
I'll readily admit that I more or less selected him by price point after the previous tuner (with his electronic tuners that in his mind showed "good enough") refused to further work on the instrument and I was pretty sure that this could not be it. I did not really expect first-rate quality given the turnaround times (and prices) of that previous factory tuner who worked by ear, but at least some improvement where the other tuner decided to call the job finished. So the level of difference was quite unexpected.
Yeah, the "friendly dealer" I occasionally visit also uses these private repairers quite regularly (when they have too much repair work to do it themselves and when it's not urgent. I have learned to do the tuning completely by ear except for the first A4 (as a reference point). But I can do tuning faster just using a tuning app, and turn to working by ear after according to the app everything is close enough. By ear you can really hear how the accordion sounds when different reeds are playing together. And especially tremolo cannot really be done just with an app because you need to hear the tremolo on subsequent notes to judge whether they go together well.
If you see prices jump up and down, I think the best thing to do is ask them why there was a sudden change! 
4 months ago that would have been less expected.If you see prices jump up and down, I think the best thing to do is ask them why there was a sudden change!
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