Switching from pa to a cba

[CC_PDX]

I switched a year and a half ago after starting PA 3 years back, so half of my box experience is on each. I switched for size, range, weight and a form factor that doesn’t offend the trad Irish sessions. I never looked back after the switch and sold or traded most of my PA’s I love the voicings and harmonic options that are made possible by the huge multi-octave reach.

 

[Walker]

@CC_PDX it's a very nice CBA you have, with the wooden finish and stepped bass.

I think your accordion would also be equally at home with the old French traditional styles too as well as Irish. Very versatile.

 

[debra]

Siegmund, if you were in the market for a genuine, high-end Russian bayan, what would you look for? Is there a particular brand or model that you would like?

I'm not Siegmund... but there are three brands that are generally desired: Jupiter (Barinov) from bayan.ru (not Gusarov from www.bayanjupiter.com), AKKO (which is the one I have) and Zonta, made in Belarus. Due to sanctions all of these are currently likely impossible to obtain. The best chance to get one at this time is Zonta. There are sanctions that apply to Belarus, but not as bad as sanctions for Russia.

 

[Walker]

I'm not Siegmund... but there are three brands that are generally desired: Jupiter (Barinov) from bayan.ru (not Gusarov from www.bayanjupiter.com), AKKO (which is the one I have) and Zonta, made in Belarus. Due to sanctions all of these are currently likely impossible to obtain. The best chance to get one at this time is Zonta. There are sanctions that apply to Belarus, but not as bad as sanctions for Russia.

Thanks @debra: AKKO, Jupiter (Barinov), Zonta...

So, if you won the lottery and could buy any three accordions (high end models) from any of the brands above (hypothetically speaking) or alternatively including high end Italian or German makers... what three accordion models would you choose?

 

[debra]

Thanks @debra: AKKO, Jupiter (Barinov), Zonta...

So, if you won the lottery and could buy any three accordions (high end models) from any of the brands above (hypothetically speaking) or alternatively including high end Italian or German makers... what three accordion models would you choose?

That's a very hard question...
I already have the AKKO bayan (full size model "super de luxe") and I absolutely love the treble side, but I find the bayan bass side a bit limiting (lowest 15 notes are fixed to LM and higher notes are all LL).
I'd like to go one small step lower in size, but not quality, so at the moment my dream accordion is a Bugari Nextra (61 notes treble instead of 64 on a full size bayan).
The other accordion that really impressed me when I tried it is the Beltuna Paris IV (absolutely great sound, 58 treble notes).
The third accordion still on my wishlist is a 1960's Scandalli Cromo Superior (the CBA version of the Super VI).

 

[Siegmund]

Paul has a big advantage over me here in that he's actually gotten try a good number of these. I am limited to searching through all the catalogs and videos and blog posts I can find.

That poses a real problem for comparing the Eastern brands. (I suppose if I won the lottery I could afford a trip to every factory to test drive them all too.)
There are lots of videos of Jupiters, at least of old Jupiters. A fair few of Akko and Tula (but not many of high-end Tulas). Just TRY and find out what the Zonta range sounds like. I've heard ONE on youtube - don't know what model, or how it was recorded. It sounded ok, but I'd need to know more before I put it on a top-three (or top-ten) list.

It would be nice to have some choices with the free-bass sound. If you have 2 or 3 free-bass reeds, most of the Italian makers provide 3 or 5 register switches for these, just like they would on the treble side. I would be fine with fewer than the usual 5 reeds and 7 registers for Stradella (in particular, without the soprano chord rank, which I have turned off 99% of the time.) A big part of my interest in freebass is because I like sustained LH notes/chords that don't drown the RH.

If I were buying off the rack today, I would be choosing among the Victoria Cadenza or Ad Libitum, the Vignoni 15PSX, and the Mengascini FC125 or Bajan.
I am a fan of wood finish vs. celluloid - I would swear it sounds better as well as looking better, but I can't prove it. That is one minus for all the Russian makers; as far as I know they don't offer it.

If I bought one with 61 notes I would want the missing notes taken off the top, not the bottom. This is probably a custom request - the usual range is G2/G7 for 61 notes and E2/G7 for 64. I might even consider asking for the right hand to start from C2 so that I had a choice of in- or out-of-cassotto sound for the lowest notes of the cello and bass clarinet, though presumably this would mean the loss of the bottom 4 notes of L register.

I have heard some very fine smaller Scandallis, so I probably ought to investigate the whole Scandalli BJC 442/453/462/473 range - but I haven't yet. I have no gripe with Bugari, other than the price tag. Conspicuously absent from my list is Pigini, which just doesn't sound right to me.

If you actually want me to buy three rather than one, I'll be making sure to have one dry tuned and one with moderate tremolo. I mentioned in a PM to you once that the Poeta V is appealing, LMMMH with an on-off switch for one of the detuned M reeds, so you can choose how much tremolo you want (but no free bass version of it - so it's not in the #1 spot.)

 

[petch]

I was in Minsk a few years ago, but had no interest in accordions then. I wonder how cheaply I could've brought a Zonta bayan back for Don't think I'll get the chance to go back for quite some time now!

 

[Walker]

That's a very hard question...
I already have the AKKO bayan (full size model "super de luxe") and I absolutely love the treble side, but I find the bayan bass side a bit limiting (lowest 15 notes are fixed to LM and higher notes are all LL).
I'd like to go one small step lower in size, but not quality, so at the moment my dream accordion is a Bugari Nextra (61 notes treble instead of 64 on a full size bayan).
The other accordion that really impressed me when I tried it is the Beltuna Paris IV (absolutely great sound, 58 treble notes).
The third accordion still on my wishlist is a 1960's Scandalli Cromo Superior (the CBA version of the Super VI).

Absolutely great choices, the AKKO is also my favourite of the bayans. Bugari Nextra, Beltuna Paris, Scandalli Cromo Superior. All beautiful. This gives a very nice mix of stradella and free bass instruments.

If I were buying off the rack today, I would be choosing among the Victoria Cadenza or Ad Libitum, the Vignoni 15PSX, and the Mengascini FC125 or Bajan.
I am a fan of wood finish vs. celluloid - I would swear it sounds better as well as looking better, but I can't prove it. That is one minus for all the Russian makers; as far as I know they don't offer it.

If I bought one with 61 notes I would want the missing notes taken off the top, not the bottom. This is probably a custom request - the usual range is G2/G7 for 61 notes and E2/G7 for 64. I might even consider asking for the right hand to start from C2 so that I had a choice of in- or out-of-cassotto sound for the lowest notes of the cello and bass clarinet, though presumably this would mean the loss of the bottom 4 notes of L register.

I have heard some very fine smaller Scandallis, so I probably ought to investigate the whole Scandalli BJC 442/453/462/473 range - but I haven't yet. I have no gripe with Bugari, other than the price tag. Conspicuously absent from my list is Pigini, which just doesn't sound right to me.

Superb button accordions. Vignoni and Mengascini are magic.

But It's hard to see past the Victoria Ad Libitum and Candenza, they are so splendiferous! Also, to do things properly you should ideally employ a resident baroque string quartet to perform every time you open the accordion case to gaze upon it.

Something like this Siegmund

And don't even get me started on the Scandalli bjc442. It's the brother of the bjp442, one of my favourite compact free bass accordions.

 

[Elizabeth]

Maybe even hear one.
What has that someone been up to? Seems like she should be thriving in today's politics.

That someone just ran for election, to finish out the house term of the late congressman don young. Oh my!! She lost to the , first woman, first Alaskan Native, and first democrat in 50 years to be elected to the house!

 

[Elizabeth]

Maybe even hear one.
What has that someone been up to? Seems like she should be thriving in today's politics.

 

[petch]

But It's hard to see past the Victoria Ad Libitum and Candenza, they are so splendiferous! Also, to do things properly you should ideally employ a resident baroque string quartet to perform every time you open the accordion case to gaze upon it.

I'd been browsing through the catalogues from a lot of accordion manufacturers and have to say those Victoria ones really caught my eye! Maybe if I win the lottery

 

[Walker]

@petch, there are so many inspiring accordions, from AKKO to Zero Sette, but if I were looking for a compact button accordion (perish the thought ), I think my no.1 choice would be the accordion model played by Sofia Ros:


Sorry everyone, but it's a Pigini.

 

[debra]

@petch, there are so many inspiring accordions, from AKKO to Zero Sette, but if I were looking for a compact button accordion (perish the thought ), I think my no.1 choice would be the accordion model played by Sofia Ros:
...

Sorry everyone, but it's a Pigini.

It's a very good choice. Bugari makes an almost identical accordion: the Bugari 540/ARS/C. Two differences: 1) It's a Bugari and 2) the treble side goes from low C# to high E and the Pigini goes from low E to high G. I have the Bugari, and it's my wife's main instrument.

 

[Walker]

It's a very good choice. Bugari makes an almost identical accordion: the Bugari 540/ARS/C. Two differences: 1) It's a Bugari and 2) the treble side goes from low C# to high E and the Pigini goes from low E to high G. I have the Bugari, and it's my wife's main instrument.

Ah yes, I see what you mean. The specification of the Pigini Super Compact is similar to the Bugari 540/ARS/C but actually I think the Bugari is slightly better because it has handmade reeds! I don't think the Pigini does. However, the Pigini Sirius Kyma would be a bit special and only a few more notes. I would definitely choose either the Bugari 540/ARS/C or the nearest equivalent Pigini.

 

[saundersbp]

I would definitely choose either the Bugari 540/ARS/C

This is also the instrument I got last year (with kind advice from Paul amongst others). It seemed to hit that sweet spot on weight, note range, price, customer service and a stable business.
I had thought about the absolute top of the range (Nextra etc.) but didn't fancy the extra weight and was also informed that pinned rather than waxed in reeds in the top models went out of tune more easily when given too much welly by the player.....plus the extra dosh!
I'm just starting to make friends with the instrument now which will be La Longue Route.

 

[debra]

Ah yes, I see what you mean. The specification of the Pigini Super Compact is similar to the Bugari 540/ARS/C but actually I think the Bugari is slightly better because it has handmade reeds! I don't think the Pigini does. However, the Pigini Sirius Kyma would be a bit special and only a few more notes. I would definitely choose either the Bugari 540/ARS/C or the nearest equivalent Pigini.

My Bugari 540/ARS/C has tipo a mano reeds, not a mano reeds. But I must say I has an even more powerful sound than the other Bugari we have, a 508/ARS/C with a mano reeds.

 

[Walker]

Some tipo a mano reeds are staggeringly good.