Playing by ear.

[BobM]

If you suggested of a tune, and a key, it could be interesting to see what we can make of it?

BobM.

 

[george garside]

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It would appear that that some people simply cannot play by ear at all, and it isnt something that can be learned.

Most people can learn to play by ear just as most can learn to play from the dots. There are some who cant do either very well. For what its worth I have taught many people including some good readers to play by ear


For instance, Ive often picked up the accordion, played a tune near perfectly on it by ear, then realised I had played it in the wrong key. I think this is quite common amongst ear players, who often play tunes in different keys. .

?why the WRONG key , playing in a different key is merely playing your own arrangement!


Try playing a tune you know well in a different key. I appreciate thats a lot harder for you PA guys, but if you can manage it, you should be able to try playing other tunes by ear.

If you know a tune well i.e. its in your head, AND you are well practised with various scales playing it in any of those sscaales should be relatively easy

george

 

[Zevy]

<FONT font=Garamond><SIZE size=125>George - You are precisely correct about those who play by ear playing in a different key. However, that is because many do not have perfect pitch. Perfect pitch is an unrelated talent, and can be good or bad. But that is a totally unrelated topic.
So I am just saying that the fact that many will play in a different key has nothing directly to do with their ability to play by ear.

 

[colinm]

Is there any scientific way, like an app, of measuring ability to detect pitch so that we can assess whether those who can play by ear have more perfect pitch ?

 

[george garside]

I'm not sure if perfect pitch is to blame but those who are fortunate enough to have it seem to be able to memorise a tune much more quickly and easily than the bulk of us who don't have this talent. An example was Sir Jimmy Shand who only had to hear a relatively complex tune once to be able to play it back perfectly in the original key or indeed in a different one if he so wished.

By way of a little 'thread drift' he was no geat respector of original keys , sometimes changing them so as to facilitate key changes between tunes in dance sets.

 

[Zevy]

<FONT font=Garamond><SIZE size=125>I think this should be pointed out:
Perfect pitch and relative pitch are two different things. One blessed with a good ear would have good relative pitch, which is the exact distance between various tones. Not as important (IMHO) is perfect pitch, which is the ability to identify the exact tone being played or sung.

 

[donn]

So I am just saying that the fact that many will play in a different key has nothing directly to do with their ability to play by ear.

I expect that was about the distinction between playing a tune from memory of the tune, vs. from memory of the physical act of playing it. If you remember what you did, to play the tune, it will come out in the same key.

That probably seems obvious - I mean, it seems a little preposterous to me that anyone would memorize the whole sequence of actions - but really I do a bit of it. I have a repertoire that Ill be called on to play, and it happens often enough that I cant recall the tune on demand. Getting better, but its quite awkward when it happens. Maybe to compensate, I have memorized the buttons Ill push in the first couple notes, for some of them. Not so much a carefully executed, effective strategy - I dont know opening buttons for all of them, or particularly the harder ones to remember, its more just that Im interested in this and thus tend to remember it to some degree. And it pretty much insures that Ill start one of those tunes either in the right key - or one a minor third away, by peculiar artifact of the CBA.

 

[goldtopia]

Thanks, I have has a re read of the previous thread on this subject and it seems there are no books specifically on playing the accordion by ear, though there are some videos. I have been having a go at "When Irish Eyes are Smiling" A slow tune just using three chords. Sounds OK with the odd mistake. Most of the concentration is listening to the chords. It makes playing the treble side much easier and you can look down at the keys more often, whereas with sheet music you can lose the place when taking your eyes off it for a scond. Also you can walk around with the accordion which you cant do with sheet music. My fiddle player was jockingly taliking about playing round the tables which would make this possible. At the moment I am just concentrating on the three chords, if I get better at it I'll try adding another chord or two. I'm surpised there are no books for learning accordion by ear. Anyone who does would probably make a lot of money out of it, though its really to do with developing ones own inner ability.

 

[BobM]

What key are you playing WIEAS in? Back in the day, I taught myself to play by ear by playing with the radio on in the background, and trying to work out the little details in the arrangement. Once I'd got the melody, I'd try to work it out again in different keys. The intervals remain the same, it's just the key centre that changes.

So now I make a living now just by playing by ear, and it's become as natural as breathing. My advice, if you're playing WIEAS in say, C learn it in F and then G etc, the patterns should start to show themselves by then. If not, go back to a simpler tune like "When the Saints go marching in".

BobM.

 

[george garside]

Glad to hear you are making progress Bill. I have considered writing a tutor book for by ear players but came to the conclusion that it would not be a commercial proposition and indeed would probably not pay for its production costs let alone my time. It is also unlikely that a music publisher would take it on

This is because many/most existing tutor books are thinly disguised tune books i.e more pages are given over to tunes than to I nstrumental technique or theory. A 'by ear' book by definition could hardly be stuffed full of pages of dots as they are what we would be trying to avoid!

There are just two sets of skills that need to be developed :

- much improved listening skills

- good instrumental technique

There are of course many 'handy hints and tips' that can facilitate the acquisition of these skills and I would be quite happy to put together a few pages on the subject of ''playing by ear '' if the 'forum powers that be' would be prepared to put them somewhere readily accessible on a permanent basis

george

 

[george garside]

we seem to have two threads running concurrently on playing by ear. Any chance of these being merged by whoever does such things?

george

 

[Soulsaver]

Glad to hear you are making progress Bill. I have considered writing a tutor book for by ear players but came to the conclusion that it would not be a commercial proposition and indeed would probably not pay for its production costs let alone my time. It is also unlikely that a music publisher would take it on

This is because many/most existing tutor books are thinly disguised tune books i.e more pages are given over to tunes than to I nstrumental technique or theory. A 'by ear' book by definition could hardly be stuffed full of pages of dots as they are what we would be trying to avoid!

There are just two sets of skills that need to be developed :

- much improved listening skills

- good instrumental technique

There are of course many 'handy hints and tips' that can facilitate the acquisition of these skills and I would be quite happy to put together a few pages on the subject of ''playing by ear '' if the 'forum powers that be' would be prepared to put them somewhere readily accessible on a permanent basis

george

Not upto me but certainly gets my support; one of the most useful offers I've ever seen. Good on you George. :tup:

 

[smdc66]

when you play a tune by ear i guess you are making it your own composition
as it may not sound exactly like the tune from sheet music

you then have options to take it where you want

the sheet music may have originated from a tune played by ear :!:

 

[BobM]

Perhaps one of the more experienced players could step forward and use this tune (When Irish Eyes Are Smiling) to demonstrate playing by ear, which could be very useful.

BobM.

 

[Glenn]

I know I've said this before but sheet music is these merely to help you. It is not a straight jacket. You can use as much or as little as you want. Just reading the key signature may be enough for some to remind them what key they usually play it in.

 

[goldtopia]

Good idea George. A lot of people would go for that. Many players would be sheet music readers who would like to play by ear so dots would be a help . I can imagine it would be more difficult to explain to non music readers which means they would have to use a bass button chart. At the moment I am just practising Sky boat song and a couple of other very slow tunes in C, which I think is the easieast key to enable better concentration on listening to the bass. I will, when I get a bit better try other keys to include multiple sharps and flats. It should make very little difference to the bass as I think it just means moving over to a different set of three chords. This subject could attract a lot of threads if a new catagory was introduced for it on the forum.

 

[BobM]

If it helps, "Sky Boat Song" in C works with a very minimum of 5 chords, (below that it starts getting a bit toxic sounding), which are C F G Amin and Dmin, not in that order though. An E7 towards the end of the middle sounds nice..

BobM.

 

[george garside]

Bob, I disagree with your statement that sky boat song works with a VERY MINIMUM of 5 chords! It will work with 3 and indeed players of 12 bass boxes and for that matter melodeons can get along fine.

The efficacy of using just 3 chords (and 3 bass notes) lies very much in how they are played. If played turgidly and run into each other they will sound crap , but with judicious 'gaps' and using variations of just bass notes, just chords , both down together and um pa pa rhythm etc they will be fine.

That is not to suggest in any way that your choice of 5 chords is ''wrong'' or that such an arrangement should not be experimented with once using 3 chords has become totally intuitive, not only in when to play each of them but just as importantly how so to do!

The key to learning to play by ear is to keep it simple - complications can come later!

george

 

[BobM]

On a smaller instrument the Amin and Dmin are easily played using an Fmaj chord with a D bass, and the Amin a Cmaj chord with a A bass? It's a question of taste I suppose..

 

[george garside]

more a question of a structured method of learning to play by ear -

I know and you know what can be done by using different combinations of bass but somebody starting to play the box and wanting to do so 'by ear'' does not! Similarly an existing player wishing to add 'by ear' skills to their reading skills will have more than enough on their plate without deviating from using 3 chords'


LATER ON , with some substantial progress under the belt, it becomes very much a question of taste, personal choice or whatever as that is very much at the heart of playing by ear, unfettered by the temptation to play exactly as someone else has so written!

George