tone differences

[Willfrick]

Hey folks I have a question about reeds and tone production.

I have a Pigini Studio B/2 accordion but I'm getting a bit tired of the brightness, reediness of the upper octaves.

So my question is, is there a way of achieving a more mellow, full sound by changing/altering the reeds?

Cheers,

Will {}

 

[JIM D.]

The mellow sound your desire will not be achieved by altering the reeds. You can however achieve a more mellow tonal quality by muting the grill. Try experimenting by having someone holding a Turkish towel over the accordion grill while you play it. If this dampened sound is more appealing to you then we can expand here on how you can install a interior grill cloth that is less acoustically transparent than what you have know.
If this is the model you have -- http://www.pigini.com/en/convertor-series/studio -- muting the grill will not be difficult.

 

[donn]

If you can find a recording of an accordion whose sound you like better, then perhaps you have your answer -- if you can find out what reeds it has, in principle you ought to be able to acquire similar reeds and install them in your accordion, though in practice it might be more economical to just buy the better sounding accordion with the reeds already in it. This seems like a facile answer as I'm writing it, but I'd be very interested in how at least the first part of that exercise might work out for you, because I personally would like to have a better sense of what reed timbres are out there and especially the especially good sounding ones.

 

[Nuuksu]

I have Accordiola Jazzmaster, it have wonderful mellow tone. I don't know quality of new ones, mine is second hand, but maybe you should try..

 

[JIM D.]

Replacing the the present reeds with reeds of a deeper tonal quality will require reeds that have larger reed plates and larger tongues. This will require purchasing a new set of reeds, altering the reed blocks to accept them (if there's room inside the box) and labor. The price of this conversion will most likely outweigh the value of the accordion itself.

 

[debra]

The way an accordion produces its tone is influenced by so many factors that there are so many different sounds available. Even accordions using exactly the same reeds (and both having or not having cassotto) will sound very different.
As others have said altering the reeds would be hard because reeds that sound less sharp are typically on larger reed plates and won't fit. The sound of an accordion is defined more by 1) how the sound is transferred from reed to reed block, by the reed blocks and case of the accordion, and by how the sound can "exit" the accordion. The cassotto is the best illustration of how changing the way the sound exits the accordion influences the sound. To make the sound of your accordion more mellow you need to dampen the sharpness of the sound or create a bit of a tone chamber.
The easiest and most effective way to dampen the sharp sound is by gluing some felt cloth on the inside of the grille. Some accordions really need this. A typical example is the Hohner Artiste IV. The same holds for many boxes that are very "filled" with reed blocks. The Artiste IV for instance has the L (16') reeds on the outer blocks. One block is partly obscured (the sound partly blocked) by the keyboard. The block on the opposite side is not obscured. The result is that half of the notes of the L reeds sound sharper (the unobscured ones) than the other half (obscured by the keyboard). Adding a strip of felt on the inside of the grille evens out the sound. Somewhat similarly the Hohner Atlantic IV N has a block of H reeds partly obscured by the keyboard and the opposite block unobscured. To even out the sound Hohner has added a metal plate to block the direct sound from that reed block. One more example is my Pigini 3-reed basson accordion. It has an L-M-H setup (the only basson with 3 reeds). The L reeds are in the center, the M reeds around that and the H reeds are on outer blocks. One block has the sound partly blocked by the keyboard and the other does not. As a result the sound of half of the notes in the H reed is different from the other half. Again gluing some felt on the inside of the grille has greatly improved the evenness of the sound.

 

[Willfrick]

Hey I really appreciate all your comments and advice!

Ill definitely experiment with mutes on the grill and look into new reeds.

Debra, I didnt quite understand your comment: how the sound is transferred from reed to reed block, by the reed blocks and case of the accordion?

The accordion sound I really dig are the weltmeisters played by the guys from Taraf de Haidouks: .

Would anyone know how they are getting such a rich, mellow sound? is it cassotto?

Thanks a mill,

Will

 

[donn]

Sure sounds like a cassotto to me, but I'm no expert.

The acoustic role of the reed plates/blocks has come up here a couple times recently. It seems to me - just my mechanical intuition about how a free reed works, put forth here for discussion - that in the simplest analysis, the reed produces the sound, by beating against the air. From there, the sound can be shaped somewhat by the internal air space and by the exit holes. The rest of the reed assembly, apart from the reed itself, from the reed plates down to the case that holds everything in place, is there to provide a solid footing for the reed - any sponginess there will dissipate the reed's vibration, muting the sound. But vibrations that go there won't be turned into sound, that's the function of the reed alone.

 

[debra]

The Weltmeister sound in the Taraf de Haidouks is from a Supita model which is the top of the line with a very dark cassotto (very mellow tone). This is great when you need it, but the downside is that when you need the 8-8 treble sound or musette it does not mix as well with the reed that is not in cassotto. Its all a matter of taste.
Part of the sound depends on how the reed plate is attached to the reed block. On most accordions the reed plates are pressed against the wood of the block and then held in place with wax. (Sometimes nails are used in addition to the wax so that when the wax hardens over time, say after 30 years of so, the reed plate still does not fall off.) Sometimes the reed plates are separated from the reed block with a very thin strip of leather, and then the plates are either nailed onto the reed block or in the case of large reed plates (with multiple reeds) they can be held in place with hooks. I attach a picture below. The large reed plates have leather+hooks and the smaller single reed plates have been fixed with wax.

The cassotto has much more influence on the sound. The reed blocks are at a 90 degree angle and the sound first goes into a chamber which dampens the higher frequencies. The size and shape and material of the cassotto all influence the tone coming out. The biggest challenge for cassotto construction is to even out the sound of the different (mostly 2, sometimes 3) reed blocks, one being deeper inside the cassotto than the other. The other influence the cassotto is that the sound exits the accordion above where the keyboard is so the problem of uneven sound between reed blocks that are obscured/blocked by the keyboard and the other reed blocks is eliminated in a cassotto accordion. Depending on where exactly the exit of the tone chamber is the sound may be mellowed down further by still being behind the register/switches mechanism or not. In the Hohner Morino D and M series the exit is clear of the switch mechanism, and thus the sound is mellowed down a bit less and on the Morino N and S series the exit is still behind the switch mechanism, mellowing down the sound further. The position of the register switch mechanism is said to be the largest contributor to the difference in sound between a Morino D or M and a Morino N or S. (The Morino N and S each have a different brand of reeds but the effect of that on the sound is less pronounced. The sound of the Morino N is generally preferred over the Morino S by people who can hear the difference, but the Morino S is mechanically newer and better.)

http://wwwis.win.tue.nl/~debra/photos/divers2014/slides/P1250121.jpg>

 

[nagant27]

a Piece of cardboard as a grille mute can also work really well. You can place it in and then cut a few long holes in it until you get the sound you are after. I have also tried this with sheet metal and it works too, but is harder to cut and work with. The cardboard is easy, quick and you can keep adjusting it.

 

[Willfrick]

Wow, these comments are great, I really appreciate the expert info.

It seems I really need to buy a cassotto accordion. Unfortunately that's not gonna happen any time soon.

But, I'm thinking of trying out different reeds, so, one last quezzy: what is an online store that might sell reeds that have larger reed plates and larger tongues than usual (for the deeper richer tone)?

Cheers