Sounds like the real thing!?

[jozz]

The "humor" is that a Turing Test as it was defined requires more than half of human participants fooled by the computer or AI.

But I get your point.

I think it's just matter of social acceptance and group bias. I doubt the Roland would be accepted even if it sounded exactly like an acoustic. After all, electric stage piano's are widely accepted and the norm, so why not the V-accordion. It's just not there yet. Probably never will be.

Still, now that I finally own one, I'm starting to see the musical possibilities regardless of its weaknesses.

 

[dunlustin]

'Still, now that I finally own one....'
Bravely said!
I do find it puzzling though - the last time anyone got upset about a guitar was , I think, when Dylan swapped his acoustic for an electric and that was about 50 years ago. Who (why?) would anyone compare Jeff Beck with Segovia?
Hey-ho!

 

[Ventura]

the other problem is we all hear with our accordion ears

fans hear with untrained unconditioned ears

so when they hear us play the songs point, counterpoint, AND Rhythm lines (bass)
all with reeds, they hear a mishmash that is often hiding the distinctions between
the songs distinguishing features

while our brains hear all parts clearly

this is why I loved MIDI right from the start, it allowed me to use a fat Bass and
a Fender Rhodes Chord with a real live awesome and powerful Accordion Reed
lead line (or counterpoint if accompanying a Vocalist or other lead voicing)
which is why i think my audiences enjoyed and allowed me to lead their imaginations
and memories with my style of play, and to keep them engaged in the music

to this day the ideal accordion for ME would be an acoustic, with MIDI, with
a velocity sensitive keyboard for additional Orchestral sound

ciao

Ventura

 

[Cheshire Chris]

I think it's just matter of social acceptance and group bias. I doubt the Roland would be accepted even if it sounded exactly like an acoustic. After all, electric stage piano's are widely accepted and the norm, so why not the V-accordion. It's just not there yet. Probably never will be.

I'm a member of a piano forum, and there are many members of that forum who just don't like digital pianos. There'll always be players of acoustic instruments who frown on electronic instruments, no matter how good they are (that's not intended as a criticism, simply an observation).

I'm a happy owner of an electronic keyboard myself, but content (for the time being) with my acoustic accordion.

Chris

 

[JeffJetton]

Well, to me the advantages of a digital accordion (which I don't yet own myself) are largely the same as a digital piano:

• Easy to amplify
• Can play more quietly than the "real thing", including completely silently with headphones
• You're not locked into just one sound
• Never goes out of tune

Are these advantages worth the trade off of not playing a "real" instrument and not getting a 100% accurate acoustic sound? I can see how the answer would be "yes" for some people and "no" for others.

Sadly, there are two advantages of digital pianos that have not yet trickled over to digital accordions: They're much cheaper and lighter than the real thing. Too bad digital accordions have still not seen the price drop, relative to an acoustic, that digital pianos have. (And it sure would be nice if they could make 'em significantly lighter too!)

 

[JeffJetton]

BTW, does anyone know the name of the first tune in the second video of the first post? (The demo of German tunes on the Roland?)

 

[debra]

Interesting that Paul's dislike of the LH bass is supported by the FR* players who opt for (say) a string bass from the non-accordion options - the LH options may well be the weakest part.
...

I do not dislike the LH bass. I just meant to say that if we want to have a "guessing game" whether someone is playing acoustic accordion or Roland then the Roland must be used with accordion LH as well as RH.

 

[debra]

BTW, does anyone know the name of the first tune in the second video of the first post? (The demo of German tunes on the Roland?)

That's "Lilly Marlene" (or however you should spell that...) If I'm not mistaken...

 

[lmschgo]

BTW, does anyone know the name of the first tune in the second video of the first post? (The demo of German tunes on the Roland?)

Vor der Kaserne (In front of the Barracks), also known as Lili Marleen, a signature song of Marlene Dietrich in the 1940s.
"Lili Marleen" is a German love song which became popular during World War II throughout Europe and the Mediterranean among both Axis and Allied troops. Written in 1915 as a poem, the song was published in 1937 and was first recorded by Lale Andersen in 1939 as "Das Mädchen unter der Laterne"

 

[JeffJetton]

Thanks, Paul & Imschgo. I thought it sounded familiar!

 

[oldbayan]

I play both acoustic and digital. Nothing sounds or feels like a "real" accordion

But the Roland boxes indeed have nice features and sounds. They are good for gigging, recording audio tracks, and for practicing in private.
I used to carry 4 diatonic boxes to my gigs, because of the required keys. Now I carry one FR-18 which plays in 12 keys with 12 different sounds and 12 tablatures, so 1,728 possible combinations, not mentioning the silly orchestral sounds.

 

[JerryPH]

It comes as no surprise that "purists" will always say that its "not as good".

The old VW beetle is better than the new one, film is better than digital photography, gas-powered cars are better than electric, Apple is better than Windows, and ford is better than dodge and of course acoustic accordions are better than digital, and so on and so forth. Folks, this is nothing more than opinion and comes as no surprise to me anymore.

It was a long time ago that I put on big boy pants and learned to make my own decisions based on my own needs. I respect others to make their own decisions and indeed push that attitude more than my opinion. The part that irks me are others trying to push their opinions on me or telling me that my choices for myself are incorrect, that's when I just turn around and walk away with a smile. Life has become so much more pleasant the day I started doing that.

The ones who prefer the old guard over the new are totally within their rights and can hopefully continue to do so a long time... but the ones willing to embrace the advantages of newness are the ones that are really benefitting big time. The possibilities are literally limitless as is the enjoyment. There is easily room on this earth for both.

A digital isn't for everyone, but equally so an acoustic accordion isn't for everyone either. That said, I really don't think it should be a "this or nothing" attitude because it *can* be a "this or that"... or even better, a "this AND that" option! Me personally, I'm kind of living the dream, because I have no such limitations or reservations concerning acoustic vs digital, I completely enjoy both and I'm kind of "living the dream" and enjoying both equally.

 

[Glug]

A big advantage of a digital accordion is the ability to set the keyboard layout.
No need to check if it's C-system or B-system - it's both and more.
That should mean they can sell more of the same model and possibly reduce the cost.

Maybe they could make the RH keyboard swappable too (keys to buttons I mean).

Of course that's got nothing to do with what it sounds like.

 

[Tom]

Ford is better than Dodge? Surely you jest! You're the best, Jerry!

 

[debra]

I'm not entering the debate whether digital is "as good as" acoustic... because that is not the point. The discussion here was whether the digital accordion "sounds like the real thing" (meaning, sounds like an acoustic accordion).
The reality is that some digital accordions use sound samples from acoustic accordions. Whether they offer the "playing experience" of an acoustic accordion or not can be debated, but they sure sound like one, because they actually have the sound samples of the acoustic one.
The same holds for digital pianos. My Yamaha digital piano really sounds like an acoustic Yamaha grand piano because it has its sounds sampled and stored. I once tried a Kawai digital piano and didn't like how it sounded, but then next to it was a Kawai grand piano and it sounded just the same.
The Roland V-accordion, just like the early Roland digital pianos (I had one for many years) uses sound modeling, not sound sampling for its accordion sounds. This creates more sound possibilities than using sampled sound, but none of these "more" sound possibilities really sounds like the real thing. Does it matter? Not if you want many sound possibilities, which is great for gigs. It only matters when you like and want to replicate the specific sound of a specific acoustic accordion. The chances of finding a digital version of that are slim. I was at some point briefly hopeful that the Bugari Evo would be able to sound like the Bugari cassotto accordions... but alas, that was not the goal of the Bugari Evo team and as far as I know not even in accordance with the agreement between Bugari and Roland... I do like my Yamaha digital piano because I really like the sound of Yamaha grand pianos. The digital equivalent of the acoustic accordion sound i like does not exist. I would probably own such a digital accordion if it existed... alas...

 

[JerryPH]

I cannot recall what company had it, but they used sampled accordion sounds for their MIDI products (Dallape, Guerrini and Scandalli)... maybe because my speakers or headphones were not of high enough quality to reproduce it, but even those did not sound exactly the same, but I had to admit, they did sound very good. Had something to do with the Kontact sound libraries, if I recall.

 

[saundersbp]

As far as electronic synthesized musical sound goes it's horses for courses, or to quote one of the UK's best authors Muriel Spark:

"For those who like that sort of thing," said Miss Brodie in her best Edinburgh voice, "That is the sort of thing they like."

 

[Ric46]

I'm a drummer. If you go to a drum forum you can read the same debate. Funny! I don't enter this endless topic...

 

[knobby]

Who (why?) would anyone compare Jeff Beck with Segovia?
Hey-ho!

Shouldn't that be "Hi-ho"?
(I'll get my coat!)

 

[Alan Sharkis]

A Roland FR-4x comes from the factory with many“sets” of accordion “reeds,” each one having fourteen registers in the treble and seven in the bass. There are also some “sets” designated as “empty.” The idea is that, using the editor software, a player can modify one or several of those “sets” by tweaking the sounds of individual “reeds” in each set and then copying the altered one to an “empty” area so as not to overwrite the factory one. It was suggested by one person that we take six months or a year and listen to all the factory sets, making notes on each register as we go along to see which ones we like. There would be nothing wrong with modifying one or several along the way and putting the results in an “empty” area as described above. Already, several people have put files of their modified sets out to share. While it is true that people can agree or disagree about what sounds good, or authentic, I’m of the opinion that pleasing yourself is one thing and pleasing an audience of non-accordionists is another. As wondeful as my 4x sounds, it’s still in a plastic body and doesn’t say, “I’m an accordion” to me. But I marvel at its light weight and its versatility.