Roland FR4X Accordian.

[Nindrakumar]

Could any one can advise me,I like to have an external wireless amplifier to connected to my accordian. What is the best portable wireless amplifier to buy and what additional accessories I have to buy in order to connect.Any suggestion will be much appreciated.

 

[Chris Laarman]

The question is clear, the answer isn't....

The real matter is this wireless connection. Your FR-4x has no transmitter built in. An amplifier or an active loudspeaker (that is one case containing both amplifier and loudspeaker) /may/ have a Bluetooth receiver built in for connecting to a smartphone or tablet. That's of no use for your accordion.
With the gear that I have, I would use two wireless sets (transmitter and receiver) for electric guitar, and plug the transmitters into the outputs of the accordion, and the receivers into inputs of a guitar amplifier. I just verified this in mono, using my FR-1xb, a cheap wireless set (the "A8" model, available from many brands) and a cheap portable guitar amplifier (active loadspeaker).
NOTE: the transmitter(s) would uncomfortably stick down under your accordion. Can be solved, but that's another matter.

This would leave your question of the best portable amp ("amp" likely to be replaced by "active loudspeaker").
"Best" depends on your intended use, the power needed, and if you want to go mono or stereo.
Also, if you should want to use PA-system active loudspeakers, you may want to insert a "DI-box" between the receiver (featuring a 1/4" jack and high impendance) and an active loudspeaker, connected by an XLR-cable.

In short: you may be wise to plan a visit to a shop selling PA-gear, have them advise you, and buy from them.

 

[Nindrakumar]

Hi Chris.
Thanks for your prompt reply. Much appreciated.

 

[Chris Laarman]

Hi Chris.
Thanks for your prompt reply. Much appreciated.

You're welcome.

Meanwhile, I've been thinking about the transmitter sticking out. More people may be interested.

The way to have transmitters (or any audio cables) out of your way underneath your V-Accordion would be: using angled connectors. And then perhaps a short extension cable to the transmitter.
This is the sort of things to check AliExpress for, but I find it tiring. You need the right keywords - and the results may be gone when you change the sorting from "best match" to "price".
I ended up ordering some female-to-female 6.35mm adapters. These allow me to use short patch cables (with angled connectors) between the instrument and the transmitter. ("Patch cables": anyone playing an electric guitar through some pedals will understand. But "plain" accordionists may be unaware.) - It's not the only solution possible, I'm not entirely satisfied, but I may use these adapters somewhere anyway.

My patch cables have "long" jacks, a bit like spark plugs. Guitar cords may feature a flat type. You could order such flat connectors and solder them onto whatever cable you prefer.

 

[JerryPH]

Budget? Intended use, personal, amateur, professional?

 

[Nindrakumar]

Budget manGB£500.Mainley for pleasure and as a hobby

 

[JerryPH]

Then basically something along the lines of the Roland CUBE and a wireless transceiver from Guitaria.

Amazon.co.uk : Roland CUBE

Amazon.co.uk : Guitaria wireless

 

[Chris Laarman]

Then basically something along the lines of the Roland CUBE and a wireless transceiver from Guitaria.

Amazon.co.uk : Roland CUBE

Amazon.co.uk : Guitaria wireless

*2 if Nindrakumar should prefer stereo. ;-)

In my opinion, using 5GHz wireless with a Cube-like amp would be (as a Dutch expression translates) "a flag on a mud barge". - I bought both some 2.4Ghz wireless stuff and some 5GHz, tried both in my apartment, then purchased more 2.4GHz. - Sure, 5GHz will be better, but probably not noticeable, yet much more expensive. (I bought most of mine through AliExpress at prices like 12 and 42 euros. The former is the A8 model I mentioned.)

To me, the Roland CUBE looks both somewhat puny and rather geared toward electric string instruments. - I have two Ammoon GA-10 of similar size and power. Yes, they are portable, and the Ammoon can even run on batteries. (It's the cheap amp I mentioned.) - I recently tested an electric bass guitar through an Ammoon and was disappointed by the lack of bass, whereas it sounded really great using a DI-Box and a Behringer PK110A, which is a PA-type active loudspeaker. (I think I used the wireless set in both cases between the instrument and the DI-Box.) I feel so satisfied with the PK110A (I have two) that I have stopped considering a new bass amp (to replace my 1980 behemoth). I'll rather use some mixer and these boxes. These Behringer boxes happen to be quite portable. I have matching tripod stands and "gig bags". (This whole project from Thomann.)

The above is not "you're wrong, I'm right", but rather some urge for Nindrakumar to visit a shop for advice and testing. (And then buy from them to pay for their efforts.)

 

[JerryPH]

1 - Stereo was not mentioned. If that is a requirement, he can move towards budget home computer speakers, still in the same $ area.
2 - don’t let the size of the Roland Cubes fool you, buskers using them are easily heard clearly from several hundred feet away, more than adequate for a home hobbyist. Their sound is proven excellent for their size and people on this board use them without issues. When I tested them out at a local Roland dealer, I was pleasantly surprised. No, not as loud or bass heavy as a Mackie Thump with a 1000 watt amp, but that is not the Aim in this case.

3 - in a hobbyist/pleasure environment, 2.4 GHz or 5Ghz makes absolutely zero functional difference, they both have the capacity to work perfectly in a 5-10 meter range.

In this scenario with a tight budget, one can still be wireless in mono or stereo for well under the 500. This is not rocket science, really, and offering advice here is not wrong. Also what shop would even think of suggesting computer speakers for someone that wanted a stereo setup (yet my own speaker set cost me $100Cdn and pushes 150 watts and has been annoyingly loud in my home many times… lol

If you start talking mixers, dual external powered speakers, wireless transmitters, you can easily go above the budget AND the complexity required for someone that all they want is to play in their living room.

I have nothing against going to a shop and seeing what they offer… but they are not the only source of knowledge around.

 

[Valski]

It's all a trade off between functionality and price. If you expect higher end performance, you can expect a higher price, perhaps heavier equipment to transport and better results. If you're budget conscious, you'll spend less but be less happy with the results. One of my biggest problems is the transport and set up of my "compact" system when performing because it fills up the back of my SUV. You need to examine your needs and make decisions based on what you have established as your priorities. Good luck.

 

[Ventura]

well, some things improve with technology advancement
some things are limited by the Laws of Physics

if you want great sound that fills a room, Bass that has no limitations,
it takes big speakers with big Cohones .. oops .. big cones in a big cabinet
that is thoughtfully crafted of quality materials NOT in a cube shape (LoL)

( a good cabinet design has all different axis from all internal corners and segments
to minimize reinforcing any frequencies.. cubes have multiple same axis geometry)

true, modern tech has made the Mixers and Amps much lighter in weight
and far more efficient electrically while maintaining a good signal to noise ratio

and of course the line array speaker tube thingies are very popular
(and very expensive) but still need that big woofer on the bottom
(you can simulate the line array distribution simply by pointing your
normal Speaker on a stand AT THE NEAREST EMPTY CORNER and let
it reflect out which is an old trick to boost the Bass too
(ok that looks weird, and can't find a good corner everywhere...but just sayin' )

Wireless systems have evolved partly because of Spectrum re-distribution,
so frequency bands are limited in availability and some are terribly
busy with competing traffic... the 5Gh band is better mostly because
it is not used for nearly as many OTHER devices

many of us in Music have found the Digital wireless systems are the
best choice for freedom from interference, because your audio is processed
by an analog to digital converter, and transmitted as pure data, which
is immune to audio interference on the same band or wavelength
(it is then converted back to analog with a DAC in the receiver)

amazingly, if you look hard enough, you can find Digital wireless
systems new and used at very competitive prices

both Scientists and Empirics have spent countless hours testing and
trying things to improve our musical instruments and supporting products,
then Capitalism and the race to the lowest price often throws out not only
the Bathwater but the Baby as well, so you have to do some research on your
own too, and not just take the latest popular offerings as actually being
the best or even that good

looking at what gigging musicians use and rely upon for countless gigs
is your best benchmark

and that is why Shure and JBL and Switchcraft and Sennheiser and such
brands and products have survived many decades of existence essentially intact
and still offering many of the same quality products today as they did Long Ago

of course, for me pretty much EVERYTHiNG was a long time ago

 

[Chris Laarman]

1 - Stereo was not mentioned. If that is a requirement, he can move towards budget home computer speakers, still in the same $ area.
2 - don’t let the size of the Roland Cubes fool you, buskers using them are easily heard clearly from several hundred feet away, more than adequate for a home hobbyist. Their sound is proven excellent for their size and people on this board use them without issues. When I tested them out at a local Roland dealer, I was pleasantly surprised. No, not as loud or bass heavy as a Mackie Thump with a 1000 watt amp, but that is not the Aim in this case.

3 - in a hobbyist/pleasure environment, 2.4 GHz or 5Ghz makes absolutely zero functional difference, they both have the capacity to work perfectly in a 5-10 meter range.

In this scenario with a tight budget, one can still be wireless in mono or stereo for well under the 500. This is not rocket science, really, and offering advice here is not wrong. Also what shop would even think of suggesting computer speakers for someone that wanted a stereo setup (yet my own speaker set cost me $100Cdn and pushes 150 watts and has been annoyingly loud in my home many times… lol

If you start talking mixers, dual external powered speakers, wireless transmitters, you can easily go above the budget AND the complexity required for someone that all they want is to play in their living room.

I have nothing against going to a shop and seeing what they offer… but they are not the only source of knowledge around.

I expect Nindrakumar to get the picture from our (all of us) reactions.

We (at least Jerry and Chris) seem to have created a new saying: "size is in the mind of the reader". I have several mixers, and the one I had in mind when mentioning it is this one. (I bought it a year ago, when I didn't feel like building the ABY-switch that I had bought the materials for. My cause was to be able to play my Jamstik Studio either as an electric guitar or controlling a MidiPlus miniEngine synthesizer in a marching band carrying a "non-CUBE" (on batteries) on my back.)

Back to "stereo" after all. Yes, it was me who came up with that. No need when playing "just accordion", but maybe helpful (to the audience) when orchestral sounds are being used. And then not "each hand a dedicated channel", but rather slightly away from dead-center. I haven't tried so, but I'm under the impression that my tiny mixer could bring that about.

@ Valski, about transport: imagine me not even having a driving license! I rely on public transport and bicycles. - Sidebar: in the late 1990s, I would play my wind controller (Yamaha WX5 controller and VL70-m synthesizer module) at computer fairs (at a booth, not on a stage) across my tiny country. When my old cardboard suitcase crashed, I bought a new one that would fit that WX5 in its protective piece of pipe, the VL70-m, a notebook computer and a pair of computer loudspeakers. Imagine me on a train (a local one to Canadian eyes) with my "doghouse" polyester suitcase (in neon pink!) and a Brompton folding bike, and then a "last mile" from the railway station to the event with that "doghouse" across the luggage rack of my Brompton... And around 1980, I would cross Amsterdam with an electric guitar and a bass guitar (in their cases) upside down hanging in ropes on either side of the luggage rack of my standard bicycle. Alternatively: a guitar amplifier and an octave divider instead of that bass guitar. Part of my "Sultans of Swing" memories...

 

[Ventura]

Chris, you seem to have figured out many creative solutions
and they worked for you !

here in the USA, pretty much the principle area where Accordionists
used public transport (Subway) in large numbers was New York, and so
Accordion suppliers came up with equipment and lightweight
innovations to help (like sprung wheeled accordion cases)

need drives innovation !

 

[Valski]

Yes exactly Chris, I've been to the Netherlands and used your trains. It was a great experience. Your cities are beautiful and the transit is awesome however the distances to be covered are much smaller.

Several years ago I saw some small amplifiers that would work as a pair for stereo sound, they were well priced and put out 35 watts each and then there was a battery operated version that only put out 15 watts each, which made them twice as heavy and twice as expensive. My FR8X puts out as much without additional amplification so my small Hughes and Kettner PA is sufficient for audiences up to about 100 people. The accordion and the amplifier is quite compact, however with mixers, stands, microphones and cables you end up with a whole lot of gear. You have to suit your system to your needs, you may make some mistakes to achieve your goals however you have to be realistic regarding expectations, budget and the end result.

 

[Chris Laarman]

Yes exactly Chris, I've been to the Netherlands and used your trains. It was a great experience. Your cities are beautiful and the transit is awesome however the distances to be covered are much smaller.

Several years ago I saw some small amplifiers that would work as a pair for stereo sound, they were well priced and put out 35 watts each and then there was a battery operated version that only put out 15 watts each, which made them twice as heavy and twice as expensive. My FR8X puts out as much without additional amplification so my small Hughes and Kettner PA is sufficient for audiences up to about 100 people. The accordion and the amplifier is quite compact, however with mixers, stands, microphones and cables you end up with a whole lot of gear. You have to suit your system to your needs, you may make some mistakes to achieve your goals however you have to be realistic regarding expectations, budget and the end result.

- Just on "pairing for stereo": my Behringer PK110A (and related models) can be paired using Bluetooth to become a stereo set. Cool!

 

[Chris Laarman]

Chris, you seem to have figured out many creative solutions
and they worked for you !

here in the USA, pretty much the principle area where Accordionists
used public transport (Subway) in large numbers was New York, and so
Accordion suppliers came up with equipment and lightweight
innovations to help (like sprung wheeled accordion cases)

need drives innovation !

- You had me thinking (about piano players...), but my thoughts went off-topic from "need drives innovation":

Sometime in the 1980s I decided to create my own washboard. (I fancied playing jugband and zydeco, and then some.) There used to be a shop in Amsterdam that served the household needs of people with far-away backgrounds. They offered two types of washboard (new!). I asked them about the differences (beyond what I could see). They replied: "This one is better for washing, that one is better for making music."

 

[davidplaysaccordion]

I am going to go the Bose s1 pro with battery route for the amp along with a getaria gws-28 set to get the audio from the accordion to the speaker. Will mount the transmitter on one of the straps using Velcro and a short extension cable. I use a pair of gws-28s to get audio from my backing module to the accordion right now and they work great. Add in some wireless midi and I am completely wireless. I converted the backing module to battery as well so I have a fully portable one man band setup.

 

[JerryPH]

I am going to go the Bose s1 pro with battery route for the amp along with a getaria gws-28 set to get the audio from the accordion to the speaker. Will mount the transmitter on one of the straps using Velcro and a short extension cable. I use a pair of gws-28s to get audio from my backing module to the accordion right now and they work great. Add in some wireless midi and I am completely wireless. I converted the backing module to battery as well so I have a fully portable one man band setup.

Sounds somewhat familiar!

 

[Nindrakumar]

http://www.elane-electronics.com/wireless/Wireless Audio transmitter and receiver.htm

Hi guys Tank you all your kind response for my post.I like to have your advice on the wireless transmitter and receiver spevially available for v accordian.Any thoughts or advise greatly appreciated

 

[davidplaysaccordion]

Jerry, I found your videos and posts very helpful in deciding on direction to go with my setup.