Beware of New Weltmeisters

[kimric]

Yes very true, in 2015 I was traveling in Europe and realized that I would be passing by their factory in Klingenthal Germany. Their website showed a thriving company and I was interested in visiting them since an address and phone number was listed. When I arrived the factory building had long been abandoned and they were no where to be found.
In comical fashion we ended up getting police assistance in our quest which led us to learn that the company had ceased production. What put me off the brand entirely was their continued web presence and offers to purchase their products as a going concern. Yes, "quality German manufacturing " strikes again.

You must have been in the wrong town or something, I have visited the factory several times in the last 15 years and actually worked there doing some design work in 2019.

 

[kimric]

@Big Squeezy Accordions I'm about to buy a new Weltmeister. Is this something I can see from the outside or do you need to open it up and look at the bellows from the inside?

The leaking corners are from instruments made in the late 90's. Weltmeister, Hohner and a couple of other makers were trying out leather alternatives. These as we can see only lasted for about 15 years. the bellows were also of a completely different construction style that was a lot easier to do. The problem with this type of design was that the "leather" had to be thinner than normal bellows leather, and required a long thin 24" strip about 2" wide.

 

[Alan Sharkis]

OK, here’s a question for some of you: Is there a difference in quality between high-end accordions made in Castelfidardo and high-end accordions made in other cities in Italy? There seems to be a difference in brand recognition here in the US. Most accordionists in the US have never heard of Cooperfisa (made in Vercelli) or G. Verde (I’m not sure of the town in Italy) and yet, both manufacturers turn out really good accordions.

 

[Jaime_Dergut]

I was warned by an old school accordion repairman to never buy accordions made from the soviet era and to be aware of newest accordions, especially from China but also Italy too.


Quality has been going down hill everywhere, he said. Newer instruments priced at 12.000$ are made out of cheap material like plastic, pine wood and held together with glue just to last long enough until they are sold.

 

[Tom]

OK, here’s a question for some of you: Is there a difference in quality between high-end accordions made in Castelfidardo and high-end accordions made in other cities in Italy? There seems to be a difference in brand recognition here in the US. Most accordionists in the US have never heard of Cooperfisa (made in Vercelli) or G. Verde (I’m not sure of the town in Italy) and yet, both manufacturers turn out really good accordions.

I don't think there us a difference. I think the builder is more important than the city of origin (as you mention). I think you can find just as good (or bad) quality accordions from Teramo or Stradella as Castelfidardo.

 

[Tom]

Newer instruments priced at 12.000$ are made out of cheap material like plastic, pine wood and held together with glue just to last long enough until they are sold.

I respecfully disagree with your friend, Jaime. Sure, there are shoddy instruments being produced, but also some beautiful, well made instruments that will sound great and out last him (or her) at all price points up and down from $12,000. Like anything else, it takes research, trial and error, and luck to get a good one, but isn't that true of everything, including old accordion repairers?

 

[kimric]

"Newer instruments priced at 12.000$ are made out of cheap material like plastic, pine wood and held together with glue just to last long enough until they are sold."

I'm not sure where to start with such a statement. Even the worst instruments like Honicas will last for years after they they get a work over and tuning. I would be really surprised if a instrument at that price point had any issues like this.

 

[Dingo40]

However...plastic components have been used in accordions at all prices for decades and it is precisely these plastic components that have caused problems through breakdowns.
Particular components that come to mind are selector switches/slides, bass buttons, logos, shoulder straps and treble key tops/keys,
I guess much depends on your time frame.
If not looking for a long term relationship, plastic should last the distance.
For others, 70 years is barely getting started!

 

[Jaime_Dergut]

"Newer instruments priced at 12.000$ are made out of cheap material like plastic, pine wood and held together with glue just to last long enough until they are sold."

I'm not sure where to start with such a statement. Even the worst instruments like Honicas will last for years after they they get a work over and tuning. I would be really surprised if a instrument at that price point had any issues like this.

That's what I heard from him. He was disappointed at the quality of materials being used in modern accordions, even in those made in Italy.
I have heard similar comments from other old school accordion repairmen.

Of course, a brand new Honica could last you several years but I think that falls short in comparison to quality of before.

I have a 90 year old Italo American accordion that still plays wonderful and had all its pieces together, even before I got it properly restored.

 

[Ventura]

ummm... i wouldn't play a honica if you paid me
if you gave it to me
if you added a motor driven blower to the bellows
if you adapted salvaged Beltuna Bass solenoids to the keyboard
and ran them from MIDIfiles

just pullin your leg

but you couldn't give one to me for real.. life is too short

 

[kimric]

The Hohnicas truly suck, but the point that seems to be missed here is that they don't fall apart after a few months.
I have not run into plastic parts falling apart.
Keep in mind that a 2 reed 120 bass accordion sold for $350-$525 in the 50s ,that works out to $4000-5000 in todays dollars.

 

[Dingo40]

Kimric said:
"I have not run into plastic parts falling apart."
From time to time members have reported instances in this forum.
Paul Debra has reported on how he's repaired coupler switches in high end Hohners.
I've had coupler switches go in a Bugari CHC 262: one after 18 months (warranty) another after 30 years ($500 repair). All good, now. Surprising how quickly 30 years pass.
Of course, nothing lasts forever: not even me! (And no warranty!)

 

[henry d]

I personally have a bit of an issue with a Hohner Morino VI M- a zippy piece of design in many regards, some of it in the "verging on gimmicky" category but surely neato keeno and a pleasure to play.

Regrettably one of the features is bakelite/plastic slides for the registers. Light, doesn't corrode, ought to be pretty slippery in and of itself- what's not to like?

The slide in the foundation plate for the RH bass reed block (cassotto) has the raised slotted end which engages the switch arm broken right off- and the same part on the matching slide for the other bass reed bank is clearly stressed where the slotted piece joins the slide.

Has anyone ever had the brass slider in a more plebian accordion break off (other than when removed and mishandled)?

The root causes seem to be a combination of the impact stress induced by the thumb slider on the edge of the keyboard and the relatively fragile slides.

In the world of saxophones Conn marketed the 28M Connstellation alto in the fifties- a top of the line really innovative alto. Many zippy features- among them a distinctive clear plastic bell key guard. "None of that stodgy, weighty old brass wire caging or pressed brass covering." The horn suffered from broken keyguards galore and it really sank an otherwise great horn.

Same same on the plastic Hohner slides.

(Fortunately the Morino is still pretty flexible even with the low RH bass reeds permanently on- but it's irksome none the less.)

 

[kimric]

I did have a nice Excelsior that had the shifter switches breaking. it was mostly an issue of trying to simplify the register switches by having the visible part of the switch button serve also as the axle shaft. The rod that engaged the shifter plates was a piece of brass that was molded into the plastic switch. It would probably never would have failed except that the shifter had become gummy with age and it required a bit of pressure to shift registers. This caused the brass to break out of the plastic.
I ended up duplicating the plastic registers out of ebony and setting a ductile brass rod into the wood. Most of the breakage in plastics I have dealt with is from stuff being dropped or hit like shattered bass feet.

 

[Dingo40]

An unfortunate fact of life is most plastics become brittle simply through age

 

[Ffingers]

An unfortunate fact of life is most plastics become brittle simply through age

A bit like myself, then

 

[henry d]

Oh yeah- blame the plastic slide failure on age. They're not even at the full two thirds of a century mark and already showing stress...


I didn't start falling apart until at least a full 70.


(fortunately the other ten plastic slides seem to be doing just fine)

 

[kimric]

Wurlitzer Used bakeilite slides, they are very fragile. I had one that broke. I was able to fix it by laying it on a flat surface with a piece of plastic cut from a baggie under the repair area. I taped everything down so it was lined up and used "gap filling" cyanoacrylate glue on the break. Let it harden for half an hr than untaped and carefully peeled the baggie off. I used a file with the part on the table to remove burrs and high spots.

 

[jollyrogeraccordions]

Going back to the bellows with perished rubberised gussets. Is there any viable solution other than replacing the bellows? I see these instruments from time to time and I’ve just been given one (it’s a Caprice with plastic reed blocks). It would actually be a nice little entry level 2 octave thing if the bellows didn’t leak. I know of a couple of people (including someone in the Marlborough Accordion orchestra) with same and there's not much to be done (or is there?).

 

[kimric]

Going back to the bellows with perished rubberised gussets. Is there any viable solution other than replacing the bellows? I see these instruments from time to time and I’ve just been given one (it’s a Caprice with plastic reed blocks). It would actually be a nice little entry level 2 octave thing if the bellows didn’t leak. I know of a couple of people (including someone in the Marlborough Accordion orchestra) with same and there's not much to be done (or is there?).

We took one of the bellows apart and sort of tried to figure out how they were made. It looked like it was possible to remove the corners and peel off the fabric. You would have to recut the inside corners since the tolerances for the gussets are different if you wanted traditional bellows, or you could rebuild them using thin Kangaroo leather and copy the old build design.