Any Mic System Recommendations?

[Squeezebox Of Delights]

I imagine this is a pretty frequently asked question here, but here I am asking it again anyway. I'm currently in the National Youth Folk Ensemble, which is exactly what the name suggests; a program run by the English Folk Dance and Song Society which brings together young musicians to form an ensemble and participate in three residential courses and a festival tour over the course of a year. It's incredibly exciting and I could talk about it for hours, but that isn't the point of this post.

Our next residential involves performing properly for the first time, at the Fire Station in Sunderland. Now, up until this point I have hardly ever performed with a microphone. Generally the venues I have performed at have been small enough for my accordion to be played acoustically (1930s Italian model, so it's very loud), but I'm definitely going to need to be miked for this performance. I'm thinking I might as well invest in an accordion mic, seeing as it's something I'm definitely going to need in the long run, so I was wondering if anyone here had any suggestions. I need something that picks up both the bass and treble sides, and I'd prefer it to be an external system, as I'm quite precious about my instruments, and don't want to have to drill any holes etc. etc.. Ideally, I'd also like a system that I can swap between accordions, as I have several which I perform with, depending on the circumstances. Oh, and I'm also on quite a tight budget, so the cheaper the better, as long as it's not rubbish.

So yeah. Any suggestions of microphone systems that might be to my tastes? I trust that a good few people here will be well-experienced in the field of accordion mics.

Thanks!

Oskar

 

[losthobos]

I'll look tomorrow but pretty sure I have what you need....I bought but as yet have not needed to use...
One gooseneck for treble side and one capsule sits on bass strap...battery pack/attenuator to control volume between the two...
Cx 516...plus power pack and bass mic

 

[Ventura]

so as not to run into problems, or waste money, i suggest you
FIRST
ask your Musical Director for advise,
and info on how THEY intend to amplify the ensemble

unless you will be a frequently featured performer, and a key
component of the overall intended sound, they may not look
kindly on any direct solo amplification or sound system "needs"
your Mics may present

they may intend to simply use Mic systems similar to those
used to pickup and gently amplify Vocal ensembles and the like
with a center stage mic for soloists to come up close to at need

here in the USA our English dance accordionists/musicians are typically kept
under close oversight by the organizations, regarding equipment

next, in ensemble settings, you must be incredibly careful regarding
the "bleed" from other instruments as well as stage noise and other
variables that can cause feedback in YOUR system resulting in
problems and/or mixed results for the Sound Board technicians

a poorly designed Mic system can quickly make you a pariah, so
be very careful and be extreme when you test and vet any system you
may consider for professional use

 

[debra]

The best external system I know is the Microvox system. See http://www.mrmicrophone.com/microvoxsite/accpage.htm
There are different models. I have always used the M420 (bar with 4 mics) that is normally held onto the grille with velcro, combined with an M400, held onto the bass side with velcro. Both have a wire that goes to a power supply with battery and volume knob and a jack plug. As an alternative to the velcro I have used a long bracket, held in place with the two bolds to fasten the grille, The bar then sita at about an inch from the grille. When you don't need the amplification you remove everything (leaving just a small piece of velcro on the bass side). I have been using this for over 10 years.

 

[losthobos]

I'm gonna trust Paul...nice knowledgeable trusted guy....
However microvox had huge feedback problems for me.... but possibly due to environmental issues...
If Paul says is fine then I'd believe..even if didn't work for me....

 

[debra]

I'm gonna trust Paul...nice knowledgeable trusted guy....
However microvox had huge feedback problems for me.... but possibly due to environmental issues...
If Paul says is fine then I'd believe..even if didn't work for me....

Feedback is mostly an issue of speaker placement (and player placement).
In this picture you get an example of one of my typical setups. You see 5 players here (plus drummer). The bass (second from the right) had built-in mics. The other four players each had a Microvox 420 mounted on a bracket (which is less ideal regarding pickup than when you mount with velcro straight on the grille). In terms of feedback it is generally best to have the player sit behind the speakers. However, we always sat in front of the speakers, so in the line of the amplified sound. In the picture you can see the "poles" of our two Bose L1 Model 2 speakers.
We had absolutely no feedback issues here. I'm attaching a second photo to show you the venue: a large castle. People who were walking around commented that when they were behind the castle they could still hear us very well. You can also see how far we were from the main audience (which started where the photographer was. I can assure you: it was very loud, yet we had no feedback.
I have done many more performances, also solo performances, for instance with a group of wind instruments (we call it a "Harmonie"), where I was the soloist playing Adios Nonino (Piazzolla) together with about 30 very loud wind instruments, again with my trusty Bose speaker (some ways) behind me, and I had absolutely no feedback issues, and my accordion was amplified a lot, to overpower all these wind instruments.
It is possible to combat feedback even more, with an internal microphone (under the grille), but that's an invasive solution. Microvox is the best when it must be external, certainly a lot better than any system using "gooseneck" mics.
For my bass accordion I have now moved to internal mics, and indeed there is a difference: internal mics are less sensitive to feedback than the Microvox system, but Microvox is still better than other external mics.

 

[Valski]

The best external system I know is the Microvox system. See http://www.mrmicrophone.com/microvoxsite/accpage.htm
There are different models. I have always used the M420 (bar with 4 mics) that is normally held onto the grille with velcro, combined with an M400, held onto the bass side with velcro. Both have a wire that goes to a power supply with battery and volume knob and a jack plug. As an alternative to the velcro I have used a long bracket, held in place with the two bolds to fasten the grille, The bar then sita at about an inch from the grille. When you don't need the amplification you remove everything (leaving just a small piece of past on the bass side). I have been using this for over 10 years.

Yes Paul is absolutely correct. You would want a strip microphone such as this because it should give better results along the length of the keyboard. I've used the clip on style in the past and they picked up some notes and were less than ideal with the rest. The price for these also looks attractive.

 

[Squeezebox Of Delights]

Thanks so much for all the information! I'm pretty sure I'll go with the Microvox M310. I already had my eye on it, but I couldn't find any reviews or anything about how well they work. This has pretty much confirmed that it would be a good choice.
Thanks!
Oskar

 

[Pipemajor]

One thing to consider with the M310 is the length of the mic.
It needs about 12" of flat space to mount it.
I found this out when I bought one for my Paolo Soprani CBA which has the large blue badge in the centre of th grill just where I would need to fix the mic .I didn't want to make any permanent alterations to the grill, so, apart from making sure it worked, it has been in its case ever since.

 

[Valski]

One thing to consider with the M310 is the length of the mic.
It needs about 12" of flat space to mount it.
I found this out when I bought one for my Paolo Soprani CBA which has the large blue badge in the centre of th grill just where I would need to fix the mic .I didn't want to make any permanent alterations to the grill, so, apart from making sure it worked, it has been in its case ever since.

Perhaps you might consider making a skirt for your microphone that would raise up the entire device enough to go around the grill badge. It would not need to be more than a couple of centimeters high and with some glue, velcro and spray paint the results should be presentable. You can get balsa wood and plastic from a hobby shop.

The best alternative would be to install microphones under the grill. These usually have knobs to adjust the volume and tone. They are also not likely to change the appearance of your accordion drastically.

 

[Pipemajor]

Perhaps you might consider making a skirt for your microphone that would raise up the entire device enough to go around the grill badge. It would not need to be more than a couple of centimeters high and with some glue, velcro and spray paint the results should be presentable. You can get balsa wood and plastic from a hobby shop.

The best alternative would be to install microphones under the grill. These usually have knobs to adjust the volume and tone. They are also not likely to change the appearance of your accordion drastically.

For some reason I assumed that these mics needed to be in contact with the body to sound.
Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[Squeezebox Of Delights]

For some reason I assumed that these mics needed to be in contact with the body to sound.
Maybe I'm wrong.

The M310 (along with presumably any other dynamic/condenser mic) doesn't have to be in contact with the body. In fact it can't be, as it is attached by velcro which automatically increases the distance between the mic and the grille.
Contact/piezo mics do need to be in direct contact with the body of the accordion, but they are quick a different kettle of fish to the M310.
The only difference raising the M310 would make is that the sound would be marginally quieter, but that can be adjusted electronically.

 

[debra]

Perhaps you might consider making a skirt for your microphone that would raise up the entire device enough to go around the grill badge. It would not need to be more than a couple of centimeters high and with some glue, velcro and spray paint the results should be presentable. You can get balsa wood and plastic from a hobby shop.

The best alternative would be to install microphones under the grill. These usually have knobs to adjust the volume and tone. They are also not likely to change the appearance of your accordion drastically.

I mounted the mic bar on an aluminium bar that I then attached and fixed to the grille using the two decorative bolts that hold the grille in place. (This wouldn't work if there are no such bolts, as for instance in the Hohner Morino N series.) The OP specifically wanted an "external" mic, so while you could install the Microvox mic bar (the slim versions like the 420) under the grille that's no longer what I would consider "external".

 

[stickista]

Another option is this Myers, which has 2 6” goosenecks and a 3rd, 47” mic for the bass side, and connection options up the wazoo.
I’m about to order one and I’ll report back.

Myers Pickups —Grip Plus-6 with Bass Extension

The perfect treble and bass microphone system for accordions. In Stock 100% Satisfaction Guaranteed & Free 2 Year Warranty No Tax Outside California Free Tech Support & Secure Checkout

www.myerspickups.com

 

[jozz]

a poorly designed Mic system can quickly make you a pariah, so
be very careful and be extreme when you test and vet any system you
may consider for professional use

I'm with Ventura here.
I reckon the system your aiming at is somewhere between cheap and professional, but in any case I would consult the venue first if applicable.
However if you are the one placing and doing all the sound yourself, you could be unpleasantly surprised if the system you choose ends up not ideal for the environment where it will be used. My advise would be to borrow some simple vocal mic's on stands placed left and right, and go from there, before you purchase something that might not be ideal. The typical strips with omni-capsules, either internally or externally, can be a nightmare in some circumstances. BTW. Goose-necks can be most ideal with quiet audiences.
good luck!

 

[Simon Max]

Hi,
My Elkovox came with internal mics, but I get feedback on my Cube. I am tempted to invest in a mixer but I'm not sure it's worth the money and bother, for the few times a year that I need it.
Is a 7 or 10 band graphic guitar equalizer any good for this purpose?
The Bherringer is about $40 and pretty compact.
Simon

 

[Valski]

Hi,
My Elkovox came with internal mics, but I get feedback on my Cube. I am tempted to invest in a mixer but I'm not sure it's worth the money and bother, for the few times a year that I need it.
Is a 7 or 10 band graphic guitar equalizer any good for this purpose?
The Bherringer is about $40 and pretty compact.
Simon

Hello Simon,

Not sure if the mixer will solve your feedback issues because this might be a question of how your amplifier is situated in relation to the accordion microphones.

I use a small digital mixer when using an amplifier and am happy with the results. Apparently mixers are powered and passive, so the smaller ones will be of the passive variety. My setup includes my FR8X, a Bk7m, an 8 channel digital mixer, and one or two vocal microphones which is effective for me whenever I need all of this gear. The mixer gives me more control over the various sound levels for these devices relative to each other because there is more fine adjustment available. Mine is a Mackie and it also wasn't very expensive, but I suspect that the $40 one doesn't give you effects which might be useful to you.

 

[Waldo]

I have a Myers triple neck right side only external mic. It mounts via a suction cup onto the treble cabinet. This requires an area slightly larger than 1 1/4" (30mm) that is free of raised (or engraved) features in order for the cup to hold the vacuum. The triple necks reach all the reeds equally resulting in an even sound. I hand mic the bass side if necessary. It should be noted here I have very little experience using amplification....mostly just at home. The Myers mics are also unobtrusive, light weight and feature an easy access volume control.

 

[Simon Max]

Thanks Valski, I think that I should borrow a mixer from my daughter and try to see which frequencies I need to filter.
The Bherringer model is an active one with a 9v battery (or power supply). I would pay another 20$ or so if I would find one that takes a USB power supply.
Simon

 

[Valski]

Thanks Valski, I think that I should borrow a mixer from my daughter and try to see which frequencies I need to filter.
The Bherringer model is an active one with a 9v battery (or power supply). I would pay another 20$ or so if I would find one that takes a USB power supply.
Simon

Hello Simon,

Your mixer doesn't provide power to your speakers so it's passive. Perhaps you might want to point the amplifier speakers in front of your accordion. Those microphones pick up frequencies and feed them back thus causing a problem. I played for years with a setup similar to yours with no problems but the amplifier was always in front. Give that a try and it will likely solve the issue.