Scandalli Super VI Barn find.

[debra]

...
We now have cleaned and re-valved every reed on the piano side. The bass reeds and chord reeds are today, also being individually cleaned and re-valved with leather valves. The old wax has been removed as well, with new accordion wax (from Italy) being used to set the reeds correctly, ready for tuning.
...

If the before and after pictures of the reed (from completely rusted to shiny like new) are indeed from the same reed I would like to know the miracle work it takes to get from one to the other. I would have considered the reed a "goner" but it seems to have been miraculously restored!

 

[belsmith]

If the before and after pictures of the reed (from completely rusted to shiny like new) are indeed from the same reed I would like to know the miracle work it takes to get from one to the other. I would have considered the reed a "goner" but it seems to have been miraculously restored!

Sorry @debra, this one is on me, I didn't attach the cleaned rusty reed. Have added it now. Tony will decide at tuning if they should just be replaced. We have access to handmade Italian reeds
We are trying to keep it as origional as possible. Some reeds have already been replaced - they don't look or sound as good quality - and messy workmanship - those we might replace.. We debated putting new Italian handmade reeds in throughout - although not sure if that devalues the instrument.
Trying to respect what made these such great accordions.

 

[tcabot]

You might get even better results if you use the PCB cleaning rubber thingie on the outside face of the reed. On the inner side, you can use a fiberglass pencil for lighter & wider rust, and carbon fiber pencil for deeper & harder to reach areas.
All of these tools cost peanuts, but with fiberglass and CF you need to make sure you have some PPE to avoid breathing the dust and getting nasty micro splinters.

PS If you decide to install new hand-made reeds to replace all of the original ones, ping me a message - I'll dispose off the nasty & rusty original ones for you absolutely for free ! And will even pay for the postage to my house.

 

[dak]

although not sure if that devalues the instrument.

It does.

 

[debra]

...
We are trying to keep it as origional as possible. Some reeds have already been replaced - they don't look or sound as good quality - and messy workmanship - those we might replace.. We debated putting new Italian handmade reeds in throughout - although not sure if that devalues the instrument.
Trying to respect what made these such great accordions.

When the reeds are in such bad condition there is no perfect solution: A vintage Scandalli VI only retains its value if it has its original reeds and if they are in good condition. The only way to get it to retain its original high value is to source old replacement reeds from a wrecked VI from the same era where the wreck sill has good original reeds. That is the main problem with these old accordions: they are only worth a lot of money if the original reeds are in there and if they are good. If the reeds are no longer good after cleaning (because too much material is lost together with the rust) then you are simply out of luck. You can turn the old accordion into a very nice one but it will not be worth as much (to a knowledgeable buyer) as one that is original.

 

[Ventura]

well one can first do the best they can with the existing reeds

there are 4 sets.. can you first make at least 2 complete sets from them ?
the primary M and the L sets in chamber
i mean many of the reeds are duplicated on other ranks

secondly, assuming even the best of the reeds have lost a fair bit of mass
from the corrosion, once cleaned i would gamble they will mostly be
sharp, so i might also shift each reed up to the next half step, as it will
be less stressful on the reeds to go up just a bit smoothing the tip area
than fron trying to seriously lower every reed from it's belly mass

then if one new set of comparable reeds were used for the +musette
out of chamber you would then have both the primary jazz voicings,
as well as a nice Musette accomplished..

then on to the 4th and last set of reeds.. perhaps enough reeds left
for a solid run with a few new reeds highest and lowest sections of the reedblock
where they would be less noticeable

 

[tcabot]

The rusty reed in the photo really did not look that bad.
Tis but a scratch.

No, seriously, it will be good as new after some light sanding of the rusty/pitted area and a re-tune back to pitch. It's close to nothing compared to how much steel gets removed when the reeds are made.
What matters is that each reed is inspected to make sure it's cleaned perfectly, it's not clipping the frame (sometimes the clipping is so light, the reed plays well, but there's a lot more harshness to the tone), it's gapped perfectly, the correct valves are installed perfectly, the reeds are waxed on perfectly.
Personally, I suspect half the value, and half the legendary status of Golas and super VIs is down to perfect set-up, as much as anything. Perfect set-up = a lot of man hours = a lot of yankee dollars.
You can take a perfect Gola, pull the reeds, do an OK re-valve and re-wax job, and it no longer plays like a Gola is supposed to. Because now the set-up is OK, rather than perfect.

 

[Ventura]

i would also like to commend everyones attention to this pic
in particular, in case you missed it.. and the others in the original post

we talk about overall scale design, elements coming together
to make something greater than just "the whole" and this is a perfect
example.. note the unusual wood area under the keytops.. how it is
very different in geometry and shape than typical keys.. note the
holes drilled to lower the mass while keeping the larger shape..

why ?

note also the two quite large pivot rods, and how the maximum
separation between their positioning was engineered in

why ?

note from the other pic the lower alignment/keyguide area
and the overall quality and precision of the master woodworking
of the slots and base

these are elements derived from trial and error over decades,
as well as an empiric thought process that constantly was asking
"what if we..."

and i assure you these elements had their genesis from Silvio himself
when he set up the perspective of his company over the decades,
and imparted those values to his apprentices so people like Marcosigniori
could, even long after his death, continue the IMPROVEMENT and
PEFECTION of the accordion into the future

i wish you all could compare side by side on a workbench the BUILD of
this accordion with several other top professional accordions new or old..
the closer you look the more you will be amazed

there were other classics which would also amaze you if you could
see the differences side by side.. like the amazing and unique Mechanical
works inside the famous Stroller Sonola's.. once you look closely
you would understand why i just laugh when internet knowledge
shouts "oh yes the sonola's built after the factory went out of business are
just as good and built by this or that other famous maker etc etc etc"
or the Super Vl built after Farfisa was gutted is even worth considering

those latter day Sonola's and Scandalli's are a JOKE compared to
the originals

perhaps some of them are actually decent, even very nice accordions,
just not if they are compared to the originals.. and some of these
pics will show you why if you look closely, and so in my opinion do not
deserve to be spoken of in the same breath

 

[dak]

Personally, I suspect half the value, and half the legendary status of Golas and super VIs is down to perfect set-up, as much as anything. Perfect set-up = a lot of man hours = a lot of yankee dollars.
You can take a perfect Gola, pull the reeds, do an OK re-valve and re-wax job, and it no longer plays like a Gola is supposed to. Because now the set-up is OK, rather than perfect.

This. It is easy to forget because "hand-made reeds" means something completely different from what it meant 70 years ago. Nowadays reeds are machined with much tighter tolerances and the amount of handiwork is much less, so the ultimate act of turning a set of different reeds into a coherent instrument with dependable and equalised response is a much more modest task and often approached with little deference and reduced to touching up only the worst inconsistencies if at all.

 

[tcabot]

One thing I've noticed is that with higher quality modern reeds, the requirement for meticulous gapping and curve setting seems to have taken the back seat.
With a set of top quality A-manos, you can get away with murder when it comes to gapping - same gaps on low quality soviet factory reeds will result in no sound at all, while the AM Italians will play "quite well". But to make that step from "quite well" to "perfect" one needs to pull them all, set a good reed tongue curvature and gap them well and invest god knows how many hours into this work, before doing a major re-tuning job.
You then get all sorts of other post-production issues - tuner's scraper slipping and deforming the aluminium slot. Just enough to make the reed sound harsh or a touch unstable. Tuners deforming the valves. Dirt or valve glue getting into the bottom of the slots. Wax dripping onto the reeds, or even into the gaps. A rivet getting a bit loose. Bass-side mechs not opening the pallets fully on some chords because not every linkage is set-up perfectly. etc, etc, etc.
Give me a Gola, and I'll turn it into a Parrot in a matter of a couple of days.

 

[Alan Polivka]

Thanks have had a look but out of stock at LB and Reverb. Have found a summary of Scandalli on line and off down rabbit holes again.

Liberty Bellows just got some more of the Super VI books in stock.