New member from Hungary

[attila57]

Hello Attila,

Well, it looks to be a smart instrument. I hope that you are able to acquire it for a decent price.

I have never tried a button box myself, having always preferred an instrument with standard keys. Anyway, dont worry about that, it is just my little prejudice.

Good luck with all your endeavours, and please keep us informed of your progress.

Kind Regards,

Stephen.

Hello Stephen and Hello Dear Fellow Accordionists,

My posting suffered a setback, because I was working really hard on the deal. Seriously, I was a bit on the down side, because the seller refused my offer on the Royal Standard first. So I went to see several instruments, including a Farfisa half-electronic accordion (Transivox Tx-11 bayan) which was advertised as in mint condition. Actually it was a piece of SCRAP, and I travelled 300 kms just to see it! I got so cross, that eventually I went back to the Royal Standard guy, and YES,THERES HOPE NOW!!! Ill get an answer tomorrow if 1000 euros are OK or not for the instrument. He looks positive, so I have high hopes to get a beautiful instrument, like new really, for a very decent price. (BTW, it was made in 1980s.) I have tried it several times and it has beautiful basses with 5 registers on the bass side, and 11 registers with piccolo notes (4 sets of treble reeds) on the treble side. Every note is 100% OK, with a rich and lovely tone. The buttons are like new, work noiselessly. There are no marks or dents of any kind on the instrument. The bellows is airtight and look new and intact. The air coming out of the instrument has no unpleasant smell. The straps are virtually brand new. It has a cute numberplate on it saying that it was made in Germany. I really cant wait to play on it! I watched every video on youtube and downloaded tons of notes from the internet, so Im all geared up to playing the accordion at last. (In the meantime Ive been playing argentine tangos on my piano and milongas on my guitar imagining that Im playing tha accordion...)

Attila {}

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Hello Attila,

I have been wondering where you had got to.

I'm sorry that you have suffered so much frustration in your attempts to buy a decent instrument, but happy that you seem to be reaching the end of the process.

You will, I'm sure, enjoy playing your new instrument when you finally get it, and I think that you have chosen a very good accordion. As I have said before, I think that the Royal Standards were built by the Weltmeister company, so you will not go far wrong.

Please continue to update us on your progress.

Kind Regards,

Stephen.

 

[attila57]

Thanks, Stephen. Today I got a confirmation, so it is now only the question of administration. The instrument belongs to a company that has just had some problems, so the accountant has to do some paperwork. I'll let you know as soon as I get it.

All the best:

Attila

 

[Glenn]

Good luck Atilla. Make sure you have the accordion in your arms before you hand over the money. A business with financial problems is a legal nightmare if things go wrong.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Attila,

I fully agree with Glenn. It is easier to keep your money in your pocket, rather than try to claw it back from a company which has gone bust. Accordion first ........ Money second.

I'm not trying to dampen your enthusiasm, but I spent a whole professional career dealing with dishonest and dangerous people. Keep your eyes wide open.

Kind Regards,

Stephen.

 

[attila57]

Hi Glenn, Hi Stephen,

Thank you for your nice and encouraging words. This thing is indeed giving me a bit of a headache. I talked to the guy who is the shop manager, and he looks a friendly and honest one, and he said that they were trying to work out a scheme with the management, but they couldn't, unfortunately. The situation is that they want to sell the instrument for more than what I can afford, and indeed, am willing to pay. The funny thing is that it is obviously an old piece of stock that they have been trying to sell for more than a decade. They set an unreasonably high price, presumably with the hope of an uninformed buyer. In the meantime the company ownership changed and then the new parent company went bankrupt. Then other companies intervened and helped them out, putting everything, including the instrument in the inventory, probably this with the old price tag, because of the recent audition. Obviously now the new management wants to make the most of what they have.
I somehow got into this mess, spotting an ad in their webshop, which is, as I have experienced it, not highly functional . So now I think I still have to wait a little until things get clearer, and maybe the price a bit lower, too.
In the meantime I have familiarized myself with the Bayan B system, making charts for myself for RH and the Stradella LH, too, calculating scale and chord patterns and possible fingerings, in the hope of the lucky outcome of this affair...
I'll inform you as soon as get nearer to that lucky outcome.

All the best,

Attila
accordionist in heart and soul

 

[donn]

Given that this process could easily stretch out for years, I wonder if it would make sense to indulge yourself with one of those absurdly cheap bayans out of the Ukraine. Tula and other makes. Only 3 rows, but that might be good thing for introductory purposes. Later when you have the accordion of your dreams, you can play the Tula in the rain or other hazardous conditions, or for situations that call for its abrasive tonal quality.

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Attila,

It seems rather too complicated to be resolved quickly, and I don't think that I am qualified to advise you any further on this particular matter. I feel that I must, however, repeat my warning to keep your eyes wide open throughout this venture.

For myself (not being the most patient man in the World) I would certainly consider offering the dealer a time related ultimatum, insisting that your time is too valuable to be wasted on vague assurances.

Please keep me informed on your progress.

Kind Regards,

Stephen.

 

[attila57]

Thanks, Stephen. Now the ball is on my side of the pitch again. I've talked to the manager again. He's made some concession and hopefully we can come to an agreement early next week... It might be some form of paying a part of the sum in instalments. My wife has also warned me of the possible dangers, but she clearly likes the instrument too, and that's a big thing, because women are rarely enthusiastic about instruments... Anyway I'm not going to give up easily. The problem is that it's difficult to look cold-headed in the arguments, because I'm quite keen to get the instrument and they obviously know it, and that there's not much competition for them on the market.

I'll inform you as soon as I have news.

Keep well,

Attila

 

[attila57]

Given that this process could easily stretch out for years, I wonder if it would make sense to indulge yourself with one of those absurdly cheap bayans out of the Ukraine. Tula and other makes. Only 3 rows, but that might be good thing for introductory purposes. Later when you have the accordion of your dreams, you can play the Tula in the rain or other hazardous conditions, or for situations that call for its abrasive tonal quality.

Hi donn,

Its great that everybody in this forum are so helpful! Thank you!

No, it isnt a Tula bayan, certainly not. Royal Standard is a 5-row German bayan, very good quality. Russian 3-row accordions are a different class altogether. Inside this German bayan is built like a normal western accordion, whereas the Tulas are very simple instruments. I having lived decades in a Soviet bloc country, I really know what Russian products are like, and Id never pay for such an instrument. Tula bayans have aluminium reed plates with screw fixing instead of wax, and similar simple mechanical solutions. They have less voices (2 & 3) than other accordions and no registers whatsoever, so they have only one, very characteristically Russian, timbre. They come with various names, and indeed, produced in different parts of the former Soviet republics, but basically they are all the same. The type actually made in Tula is the best and most well-known among them. Certainly, you can use them even in the harshest conditions in the cold of Siberia and you can even sit on them, they are so massive. In spite of their simplicity, they have really very nice basses, because their reeds are rectangles instead of the tapered form that the reeds of western accordions have. They are good for Russian popular songs, but not for classical, Spanish and South American music, that Id like to play. FYI, in terms of market value, a Tula bayan is about 1/10 - 1/20 of this Royal Standard Im going to buy (hopefully I can...).

Sorry, I didnt mean to be too clever, but actually, I must confess, I saw a Tula bayan a few weeks ago, in the search of the right instrument. I had known nothing about them before, but did some search on the Internet, and in the end, I had the stuff in my own hands. That was the point when I said to myself, no cheap Russian bayans, please...

All the best in music:

Attila

 

[donn]

I having lived decades in a Soviet bloc country, I really know what Russian products are like, and Id never pay for such an instrument.

Sure, since youre confident that this accordion you want is not far off, then thats the thing. Its only the prospect of a would-be player making do with paper charts and such, possibly for a very long time, that makes me think of a short term expedient like that. The lowest quality accordion makes a better accordion than a paper chart.

But since that isnt an issue after all, we can take the conversational tangent that you bring up. Inside this German bayan is built like a normal western accordion. So really it is a normal western accordion, right? Not so much a bayan, which does refer to the physical differences you mention - reed shape, no-wax construction, maybe multiple reeds on a block, Stradella differences etc., even in higher quality instruments. As someone who cherishes the expressive potential of language, I always hate to see words redefined to be synonyms with each other, even when theres some basis for it as there is here. Not pointing this at you so much, since you didnt start using the word here yourself until the Russian makes came up, just taking the opportunity to say bayan doesnt mean B system (in fact, I believe its purely a coincidence and B here may refer to the note B, but I cant back that up.)

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Attila,

I am very pleased to learn that your Wife supports your choice of instrument. In my experience, Wives are usually right. Even when they are not right, Wives tend to work their way around to putting you in the wrong.

I am really hopeful that you can clinch this deal very soon, but still advise caution.

All The Best,

Stephen.

 

[attila57]

Its only the prospect of a would-be player making do with paper charts and such, possibly for a very long time, that makes me think of a short term expedient like that. The lowest quality accordion makes a better accordion than a paper chart.

Inside this German bayan is built like a normal western accordion. So really it is a normal western accordion, right? Not so much a bayan...

,

Hello donn,

As for the paper charts, I didnt quite get your point first, sorry. Sure, a Russian bayan is better than a paper chart! Thats why I went to see it. But I didnt like the instrument, and I wouldnt like to play it. So Id rather wait a little. I have some instruments at home, guitars (6-,7- & 10-string), a baroque lute, keyboards (piano, synth, clavichord), so I can keep myself busy in the meantime. The chart was an experiment to test if I like the B system or prefer the PA.

Concerning the name, yes, the Royal Standard is not a bayan, its a 5-row B system button accordion. And its a good thing, too!

Attila

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Attila,

You are obviously a very competent man, and I truly believe that you will arrive at your decisions in a logical fashion. As long as you get the deal that is right for you, nothing else matters.

The Royal Standard sounds like the ideal instrument for you, and I hope that you are able to acquire it very soon.

I understand that you are fond of Spanish & South American music. A very good friend of mine plays Classical Spanish Guitar at our Folk Club. Peter is a truly excellent guitarist, and we look forward to hearing his virtuoso performances every week.

Kind Regards,

Stephen.

 

[JIM D.]

Yes Steve:
A half century ago Weltmeister accordion's found their way here in the US with 3 different badge's.
Weltmeister -- Worldmaster -- and -- Royal Standard . Same boxes, different badge's. They were made in the Soviet Block and their quality was inferior to German made Hohner's at the time. Once the cold war ended the Weltie's started appear in finer quality and today are superior to a China made Hohner Box.
Not selling well here in the East US but, in the West they seem to be selling well.
I've had 3 in the shop for minor problems and found them to contain quality Italian machine made reeds and although a mediocre made accordion, the build and quality is correct for the price they sell for.

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Jim,

I am acutely aware of the historic geopolitical situation vis-à-vis Eastern Europe, as I was with the BAOR for some time. I also know that the dominant political system ensured a nose-dive into manufacturing mediocrity.

My Galotta was made in the Weltmeister factory, and it is a fine instrument. The Bass is deep and the Treble clear, which is pretty good for an old instrument. I have no idea what kind of reeds are contained within, nor does it matter much.

Attila has played the Royal Standard he wishes to buy, and rates it very highly. With his very impressive musical background, I would say he knows a good sound from a bad one.

Perhaps you could repeat your observations regarding "quality Italian reeds" in the current thread on that subject, as many appear to doubt the evidence I have presented.

I have looked at many accordion brands on-line, and would certainly consider a Weltmeister at some time in the future. A very dear friend of mine owns a Bugari, which is another instrument I admire very much.

 

[JerryPH]

Just speaking generally, I am not sure if one could directly compare a Weltmeister to a Bugari. It's a bit like comparing a Cooper to a Ferrari. Both are cars, but one has some obvious advantages.

 

[JIM D.]

Yes, -- Apples & Oranges .

 

[Stephen Hawkins]

Hello Jerry,

I did not make a comparison between the Bugari and the Weltmeister; all I said was that I quite like both machines. The Bugari is far and away the sweeter instrument, but that doesn't stop me liking the Weltmeister.

About fifty-five years ago, I bought a new Clarinet. Most Clarinets are ebonised, but mine was a natural wood colour which had been varnished. It was about the cheapest one in the shop, as I had very little money to spend on Clarinets. (Girls were my big hobby at the time)

After a while the cheapness began to show, as the joints became slack and badly fitting. Toilet paper wrapped around the male joints during assembly formed a decent enough seal and, believe it or not, the instrument still played beautifully.

I would not have swapped that instrument for the best Clarinet in the World. I had saved hard to buy it, and it did everything I wanted it to do. In fact, though I say so myself, I played a mean Clarinet in those halcyon days.

Though I have so far resisted the temptation, it is just possible that I may soon buy a 120 Bass instrument. A Bugari would be lovely, but I just can't justify the cost. The front runner at the moment is the Pearl River, which many on this site dismiss as being hopeless. Rightly or wrongly, I do not share that view.

It is a question of horses for courses, and my needs will all be satisfied with a Pearl River.

Cheers,

Stephen.

 

[JerryPH]

I did not make a comparison between the Bugari and the Weltmeister; all I said was that I quite like both machines. The Bugari is far and away the sweeter instrument, but that doesnt stop me liking the Weltmeister.

There are several models of Welties that I also like. It seems to be a popular enough instrument in the Czech region of Europe, a few of my remote accordion friends have them and are all quite satisfied.