Was there any relationship between Cemex and Sem ?
Maybe the Oldest Old-Timer
- Thread starter Riccardo
- Start date
Alan Polivka
Active member
Thank you, Riccardo.
Ventura
Been here for ages!
none except peer rivalry
the original sem factory where the famed Gabbanelli models and Piermaria and many
many private brands were built was also a fully, vertically iintegrated factory
who could craft the entire accordion on premises from raw materials,
excepting they purchased kilned woods rather than raw (cemex even had a kiln)
They even had installed a crazy modern working Plastics assembly area that was
beginning to turn out student sized accordion bodies. They had one of the last full fledged
old style Black Hands Celluloid processing wings (the kind that were outlawed)
a Family Member from Piermaria was always present at the facility, had a top
management position and a vote on the Board. the Gabbanelli Family Italy
branch had primary control of the company. Anecdotal evidence presented
by Jerry and online sources suggest ELKA had some kind of buy-in at some point
in time, and Elka(vox) bodies came from/were buit by SEM, though ELKA's
bankruptcy apparently had no affect on SEM's viability or day to day operations
it is somewhat difficult to find "SEM" accordions as they never marketed their
own brand, though some Organ and Electronic accordions from Iorio
Elka and Orla carry a plate on the back with a "built by"
it was a huge place and the only true Rival to CEMEX for in house capability,
as all other accordion factories left were dependant on commonly sourced
finished parts, assembies, even bodies by the late 20th century
when SEM fell it was the "tree in the forest cataclysmic sound" no-one heard
because it was so sudden, so complete, and so physically final, yet so shrouded
in disinformation because after the bankrupcy sale and dissolution of all physical
factory assets, the Name/brand/contract list intellectual property rights were purchased
by an old accordion company up on the hill, and suddenly there was a SEM branded
accordion line being marketed in the USA and elsewhere.
Riccardo
Member
Ventura You obviously have a great deal of knowledge re the more modern times accordion busIness in Italy. I found it really fascinating. It's added much to my older experiences and memories. Thank you.
Riccardo
Member
Hello JerryPH. I'm unsure whether you or someone else asked me about the serial numbers - especially on Excelsiors. I think it was to try to discover date of manufacture.. As we know, that's really difficult in most cases since many sat on shelves pending sale.
Have done a bit of digging out a few of my collection and here's what I found..
The oldest in my collection and laced with rhinestones gold colour mint condition SPECIAL EXCELSIOR MODEL NEW YORK (on the grill) with 2 treble registers marked PIETRO'S SYSTEM and 1 chrome bass register Factory Serial on the back of the treble # 2587.
There are 2 arrows on the grill to show whether the registers are open or closed. Typical of models in those days.. And there's a small label on the bottom of the treble board marked NY Patent 1927 and 1928. It's in its original case I believe. All in excellent condition.
My first Symphony Grand was purchased in Feb. 1951 Serial no. 9999 from my Teacher Elio Viola in Hamilton.
My second Symphony Grand purchased in 1954 factory serial # 11157 which I still have. BTW, I just recalled when I took delivery from Jack Wright, Mario Pancotti happened to be visiting and I had a chance to find out more about the company's history! He was most gracious!
I have an Excelsiola 120 4/5 mint purchased by one of my students in 1955. Montreal Excelsior Supply on bottom of the bass section imbedded # 2727 and returned to me years later. Jack used that process to register his sales for years.
And an Accordiana student model 305 with Excelsior Supply bass imbedded # 6752 and another 305 with #6827 imbedded.. These are likely from the 1970's or 80's or even later.
Also have several early rocker switch models - both Excelsior and Accordianas as well as other makes, and an Accordiana Bass accordion used in our quartet numbers. (Favourite was Bach's Little Fugue in g minor. Know it?)
I should learn how to upload some photos. Bit of a computer dinosaur... miss my Commodore 64!!
I don't know if this is of any interest to you, but if others read it and have Excelsior products it may help to determine age of their instrument .. or may confuse as well!.
Even unsure if this gets wide distribution or to you only. Take care Stay safe and well.
Hi Riccardo! No that was not me, but you did make a comment about seeing Gola bodies on the Excelsior company floor and I'd liked to know about that. I am a lifetime Gola lover and recent purchaser of a Gola 459 (5/5 reeds and 185 button free bass) and love to hear anything about Gola accordions (good OR bad!).
Thank you so much Ventura for your detailed reply.
My reason for asking is that I have just bought ( it arrives tomorrow) an Elka CBA LMMMH
which has a SEM badge also on the front.
The original owner ( now passed on) bought it new around 2005/6 so it would have been just after the demise of SEM.
The accordion is being sold on behalf of the widow by a good friend of the deceased and he told me that they both played piano accordions together since early childhood.
The man had wanted to try CBA, so bought this one new from a local dealer, tried it for a few weeks but decided he was too old to make the change so it was put away and only brought out on very rare occasions.
He has also examined it thoroughly on my behalf and says it is in perfect condition, apart from the straps which he had changed over with the old straps from his piano accordion.
I think the sender must have been following the recommendations by you here, because he has followed these to the letter. He has also sent be 12 photos showing every step in the packing procedure.
As it is 400 miles away I'm having it couriered down to me using a courier company who specialise in transporting fragile goods, especially musical instruments, so, fingers crossed, it should arrive safely.
Ventura
Been here for ages!
hmmm.. that might need more investigation
ELKA was dead and gone for a dozen years before SEM imploded
this may be creative use in the European market of old chrome
nameplates being used independantly of actual factories, legalities, or history..
there could have been ELKA dealers of long standing who simply
wanted to continue offering the brand, as they had built it up in
their local market over decades of representation
not that it might not be an excellent accordion regardless, and of course
running down an actual lineage might be impossible anyway..
has anyone else here ever seen a 5 reed treble ELKA at all ?
i suppose in Europe there may be other Chromatic ELKA's though
i found an lmm chromatic ELKA photo from an old reverb listing,
but htat was it for the USA
also, it sounds like your ELKA coming was never an Organ Accordion at all,
just an acoustic from the get go, or the fella would have had to be filthy rich to sit
on a new $5000 device in a closet just because he changed his mind
as Jerry and others have noted, there apparently were some very high quality
accordions sitting under ELKA electronics, but it is really difficult to fit
much into any Electronic accordion besides the circuitry.. ELKA never did reach
the digital age of mminiaturization
hope it is a great box and a real deal for you
ELKA was dead and gone for a dozen years before SEM imploded
this may be creative use in the European market of old chrome
nameplates being used independantly of actual factories, legalities, or history..
there could have been ELKA dealers of long standing who simply
wanted to continue offering the brand, as they had built it up in
their local market over decades of representation
not that it might not be an excellent accordion regardless, and of course
running down an actual lineage might be impossible anyway..
has anyone else here ever seen a 5 reed treble ELKA at all ?
i suppose in Europe there may be other Chromatic ELKA's though
i found an lmm chromatic ELKA photo from an old reverb listing,
but htat was it for the USA
also, it sounds like your ELKA coming was never an Organ Accordion at all,
just an acoustic from the get go, or the fella would have had to be filthy rich to sit
on a new $5000 device in a closet just because he changed his mind
as Jerry and others have noted, there apparently were some very high quality
accordions sitting under ELKA electronics, but it is really difficult to fit
much into any Electronic accordion besides the circuitry.. ELKA never did reach
the digital age of mminiaturization
hope it is a great box and a real deal for you
Riccardo
Member
Hello again Jerry. Regarding your question about GOLA accordions, I can only share what I recall what was told to me by several older artisans and admin personnel those many years ago while learning about accordion construction in the Via Sardegna Excelsior factory in Castelfidardo. For obvious reasons I was asked to withhold my experiences for at least for 25 years That time has long passed as I'm sure have the individuals who may have been involved.
Evidently GOLA (who may or may not have worked for Hohner at the time, ) asked Excelsior for permission to visit the factory as a means of learning about the construction, especially of the higher end models. I believe some called him "Professor" Gola since they were either informed or believed he was an accordion teacher. The artisans told me that he was seen taking notes and possibly photographs of some of the operations. Not knowing whether he had permission to do so, no one challenged him of course. After he had left, the situation was reported to admin, as I was informed, but nothing was said to the workers about following up, at least that's what was told to me.
And, I can't remember when, but I was looking at some 'boxes' and roughed-in keyboards in another area of the factory which looked identical to the Symphony Grand models and was informed that they were either for Hohner in Germany or some other company but were not to be finished completely for whatever reasons. And that's about all I can recall re that experience.
In my future servicing accordions, I had occasion to open up and service a few GOLA's sent to me and I was struck by many of the similarities as found in Excelsiors. I felt that GOLA's were very fine instruments and many professionals performed on them for years.
(Can't help but suggest it's a bit like comparing Steinways with Boesendorf or Stradivarius with Amati.... or Ferrari with Lamborghini!!)
I suppose if one were really interested in making a detailed comparison of two or more makes of accordions, a "forensic audit" may be interesting, but only if one has the finances, time and curiosity. And what do you do with the pieces????
Regarding any similar or especially identical parts, models, nomenclature, shapes, etc., regarding Gola's or any other makes, one may draw one's own conclusions but I must add that old quotation by Colton that, "Imitation is the sincerest form of Flattery!"
Finally, my bottom line is simply, "If you like it, Enjoy it". And especially if you have the health, time and motivation...All will pass!! Some too soon.
Evidently GOLA (who may or may not have worked for Hohner at the time, ) asked Excelsior for permission to visit the factory as a means of learning about the construction, especially of the higher end models. I believe some called him "Professor" Gola since they were either informed or believed he was an accordion teacher. The artisans told me that he was seen taking notes and possibly photographs of some of the operations. Not knowing whether he had permission to do so, no one challenged him of course. After he had left, the situation was reported to admin, as I was informed, but nothing was said to the workers about following up, at least that's what was told to me.
And, I can't remember when, but I was looking at some 'boxes' and roughed-in keyboards in another area of the factory which looked identical to the Symphony Grand models and was informed that they were either for Hohner in Germany or some other company but were not to be finished completely for whatever reasons. And that's about all I can recall re that experience.
In my future servicing accordions, I had occasion to open up and service a few GOLA's sent to me and I was struck by many of the similarities as found in Excelsiors. I felt that GOLA's were very fine instruments and many professionals performed on them for years.
(Can't help but suggest it's a bit like comparing Steinways with Boesendorf or Stradivarius with Amati.... or Ferrari with Lamborghini!!)
I suppose if one were really interested in making a detailed comparison of two or more makes of accordions, a "forensic audit" may be interesting, but only if one has the finances, time and curiosity. And what do you do with the pieces????
Regarding any similar or especially identical parts, models, nomenclature, shapes, etc., regarding Gola's or any other makes, one may draw one's own conclusions but I must add that old quotation by Colton that, "Imitation is the sincerest form of Flattery!"
Finally, my bottom line is simply, "If you like it, Enjoy it". And especially if you have the health, time and motivation...All will pass!! Some too soon.
Thanks Ventura,
there is a plate attached to the rear with a model no. 602.
It is a purely accoustic cba with no electronics.
When it arrives I will post a few photos
Riccardo
Member
Hello Tom. I've submitted several messages over the last few weeks, and since I'm really inexperienced with this form of 'chats' I don't know if they receive wide or specific distribution in answering some questions asked of me by others. I hope it's wide since I wouldn't want anyone to feel I'm ignoring their questions or comments. I have nothing to hide.. Hope this gets to you and as you requested, you can access some of my history with accordions, especially with Excelsiors and related stories.
Thanks Riccardo! Your thoughts and recollections are very interesting. By the way, if you click on the “envelope” between the “R” and the “bell” on the top row to the right of “The Accordionists Forum” you can send someone a private message. Otherwise, posts can be seen by everyone.
Ventura
Been here for ages!
hay Riccardo,
first, it is a pleasure to hear from someone who has been there, seen that,
and can help others understand just how important Excelsior was to this industry,
and the standard they set for "quality" simply by doing their best every day.
these chat type, mostly text based forums are an extention of the older
pre-internet communication and group style of information and idea exchange.
your messages are spun around the world, and some people who follow
the postings see them right away, others may not find them for a week or a month,
but it is always worth it to post stories and information, answer questions,
as it contributes to the general knowledge base and helps others know,
especially, that they are not alone ! Some may interact with you/your posts
directly, others may be too shy, but are very glad to hear from you,
and a few will have something to say (about everything) of course
we hope you enjoy us as much as we will enjoy you
ciao
Ventura
first, it is a pleasure to hear from someone who has been there, seen that,
and can help others understand just how important Excelsior was to this industry,
and the standard they set for "quality" simply by doing their best every day.
these chat type, mostly text based forums are an extention of the older
pre-internet communication and group style of information and idea exchange.
your messages are spun around the world, and some people who follow
the postings see them right away, others may not find them for a week or a month,
but it is always worth it to post stories and information, answer questions,
as it contributes to the general knowledge base and helps others know,
especially, that they are not alone ! Some may interact with you/your posts
directly, others may be too shy, but are very glad to hear from you,
and a few will have something to say (about everything) of course
we hope you enjoy us as much as we will enjoy you
ciao
Ventura
Riccardo
Member
Thank you for your comments. I really appreciate them. As I posted in an earlier thread, despite a hiatus when other professional opportunities were required "to put food on the table, take care of my family, and ensure a reasonable and productive future," accordions have been in my blood ever since about 6, when I scraped my thumb on the sharp edge of a 12 bass keyboard!
And it has also encouraged me to take out my Symphony Grand and try to refresh those days of Frosini, Deiro, Magnante, Gaviani, Biviano,Van Damme, Galla-Rini, and innumerable others...
My "Schtick" on the concert stage was the classics ranging from arrangements and adaptations of Bach, Chopin, Rossini, Verdi, Enesco, Paganini, to Prokofiev, etc. as well as many originals composed by those pioneering accordionists.
Even had the privilege of performing with Arcari, Carrozza, Ettore, Desideiro, and even Magnante - and that latter was by accident!!
Apologies, I get carried away with pleasant memories..
Good luck with Albini.
And it has also encouraged me to take out my Symphony Grand and try to refresh those days of Frosini, Deiro, Magnante, Gaviani, Biviano,Van Damme, Galla-Rini, and innumerable others...
My "Schtick" on the concert stage was the classics ranging from arrangements and adaptations of Bach, Chopin, Rossini, Verdi, Enesco, Paganini, to Prokofiev, etc. as well as many originals composed by those pioneering accordionists.
Even had the privilege of performing with Arcari, Carrozza, Ettore, Desideiro, and even Magnante - and that latter was by accident!!
Apologies, I get carried away with pleasant memories..
Good luck with Albini.
Riccardo
Member
Grazie Ventura
I recently was asked about gluimg reed leathers to reeds and was reminded of some of my experiences. Glad to share if it is of interest to anyone.
During one of my stays in Castelfidardo years ago I was introduced to 'El Maestro' of reed leathers who spent a few hours explaining how he purchased the skins, stores, ages and cuts reed leathers. He was an independent and not employed by any company and all he asked was not to advertise his name.
His leather of course was of highest quality. Aging of skins was in his small shop over the shelving and when checking them over for softness, colour and thickness, he ran his fingers carefully over almost every square cm. He explained that leather, like wood, has a grain!! - And it is important to cut for reed leathers along the correct grain. He asked if I would build a house using wood cut across the grain, and of course we
had a good laugh, but I saw him carefully turn the skin around several times before using a very sharp knife to cut strips, and sort them according to thickness,.. He had a small razor-sharp "guillotine" cutter which he sued to cut the leathers to specific sizes and thicknesses.
They're the ones used to attach to reeds of course, and others of slightly lesser quality for the valves.. sorted, packaged, labelled and sent to purchasers or factories. Yes, hand made and worth every lira, cent or Euro paid! Should explain why some leathers last a few months and others decades!!
Back home, I was introduced to the best adhesive - in my opinion- for not only reed leathers and valves, but for many other needs.
That was a product called Pianophile Adhesive.. Made in Montreal then as I recall and unsure if still operating.
What I liked about it was that it was a non-petroleum and non-toxic latex-based adhesive. Great unless you're latex sensitive I suppose.
Even used it to bind books and other items requiring some degree of flexibility.
Must add that some manufacturers evidently started to use either plastic, vinyl or some type of poly-whatever material to make reed"leathers", likely when leather became scarce or too pricey... As we know, some plastics and vinyls have a "memory" and I recall a few instruments sent to me for repair with curled up "leathers". That was likely due to the instrument being stored in a warm room - or worse in a vehicle and we know what happens there, --causing the plastic to shrivel or curl up!! Not a good idea regardless as is keeping it in damp basements. or hot attics.
Hope this is of interest especially for those who make repairs. Ciao
I couldn’t find this but do see this one, advertised as good for keys, cloth, felt, and leather. Perhaps it would work.
JKJ
Riccardo
Member
Thank you. If PVC means Polyvinyl Chloride it may have s a petroleum base and many are allergic to that chemical, including me.
According to what I've read, that chemical, among many others, may also have carcinogenic qualities, but not being a scientist, I don't know for sure. However I avoid as many unproven or unknown chemicals as possible.... Checked and Pianophile seems to still be operating out of Montreal.
According to what I've read, that chemical, among many others, may also have carcinogenic qualities, but not being a scientist, I don't know for sure. However I avoid as many unproven or unknown chemicals as possible.... Checked and Pianophile seems to still be operating out of Montreal.
Dingo40
Been here for ages!
I may be wrong, but it says "permanently closed " on here:
Similar threads
-
- Locked
