Lighter Accordion

[colinm]

I have been looking for a lighter accordion for about a year, have tried a borsini compact 80 bass-keys too small, guerrini oxford-keys too small, excelsior 1304-keys slightly too small.
Does anyone know of a 96 bass with keys the same width as my 120 bass, i.e. 17 3/4 " for 22 keys

 

[george garside]

unless your 120 bass box is extremely heavy you wont save much , if any, weight by coming down to 96.. eg Fisitalia120 10.5k 96 9.8k 9both 4 voice). weltmeister cassotto 12010.8 96 10.4. However there are 3 voice 96 bass eg pigini p75 at only 7k and the useful 60 bass weltmeister Rubin 2 voice is only 5.6k more or less half the weight of many 4 voice 120 bass boxes. These are just a few randon examples given just because I have the data to hand

george

 

[Soulsaver]

Is there some mistake here: My Guerrini Oxford 3 - 22 white keys measure 17 5/8" - Is the extra 1/8 over 22 keys a problem?
My Excelsior 1304 22 keys is smaller than the Guerrini at 17 1/2"?


I'd have thought you get used to that fairly quickly?

What model is the 120?

BTW I find it's not the weight per se of a 120 but the bulk that I struggle with; although for some reason an Excelsior 120 doesn't seem to give me the same problem. Wierd.

 

[george garside]

I think that its not just weight but total ''fit and feel'' that matters as the box is the only instrument that you 'wear' in much the same way as a garment. A good 'fit' is crucial to a feeling of well being!

there are so many variables, bulk, width and padding of straps, angle of keyboard to treble end, response of reeds (effecting bellows effort required) etc etc. Then there is the factor of assorted size and shape of anatomy to add to the equasion! Which is why its always best to try before buying.

I am thinking of selling my 3 voice 48 12x4 BCC# Guerini which is a lovely box in spot on condition. I bought it from a distance to replace my ,same spec, casali that I have played for 20 odd years. The Guerini is a lovely box but just doesn't sit as well on me as does the casali - so if anyone interested in the guerini its available at a avery reasonable price

george

 

[colinm]

Thanks for your replies, I have not got the Guerrini now, so may be the problem was that the black keys are slightly thicker , nearly 1mm, they are on the excelsior
Maybe I am being too fussy but it took me 2 years to get used to my 120 bass scandalli, and I would like to be able to swap easily between the accordions, the scandalli weighs 12 kg

I just want a lighter accordion with a keyboard like the scandalli
Each time I try a new accordion it costs me at least £100 on ebay

I am trying to use your collective knowledge to minimise this cost, my wife thinks I am just wasting money
I have a left shoulder problem, rotator cuff, which 3 physiotherapists have failed to fix, so I just ignore the discomfort
Maybe it would be better to go to a 3 voice 120 bass, I would like to get below 9kg

Once again thanks for your suggestions

 

[Soulsaver]

Ah ha! The Scandalli - yes mine has the biggest keys of all - 22keys measure 17 7/8ths.. I make all 3 black keys 9mm out of intrrest.

Didn't realise you'd plan to swapping back and forth - assumed you were making a change - still not sure such a small diff should be a prob but it is if it is, I guess.

You may struggle to find something 'cos I have 12 accordions and none are as big keys as the Scandalli.

Maybe the most economic route may be to go for a Scandalli 96 bass and sell the bigger one, if you can make do...

 

[Anyanka]

The Pigini Wing is considerably lighter than anything else in its class & size: 120 bass, 37 keys, 4 voices. 7kg. I haven't measured the keys.
I'll be putting my Wing up for sale soon as I've switched to CBA.

 

[colinm]

Anyanka
Is the wing electronic

 

[george garside]

no!
g

 

[colinm]

The wing is compact so it will have small keys, please do not tell me I am looking for something that does not exist, I am going to keep the scandalli, I just want another lighter. probably cheaper accordion that I can carry easily and play along with the scandalli easily

 

[Glenn]

If you really want light, go for a Roland V accordion. It is electronic and has no heavy internal reed banks etc.

Basically a bigger key means longer keyboard which means more wood which results in more weight.
If you want full size keys you will have to reduce the density of the accordion.
This can be done by having less voices in the bass and treble.

A CBA will be lighter as the keyboard is effectively shorter.
I also hear helium filled cassottos help.

 

[fjsys]

If you look at the 7x it is about the same weight as my acoustics. The 3x is lighter, but missing a couple of keys.
And i have heard that the 8x is heaveir then the 7x.

Victoria has a new full sized that is light (9kg according to them)

Ben

 

[colinm]

I tried a roland and did not get on with it, too electronic.
Victoria, has it got a scandalli size keyboard?

 

[Soulsaver]

The FR3 has smaller keys than the Scandalli 17 5/16s - & I'd guess the FR7&8 s will, too.

 

[fjsys]

I tried a roland and did not get on with it, too electronic.
Victoria, has it got a scandalli size keyboard?

I am not sure on that, you can always email them and ask. I have found them very responsive to all of my questions.
They have a great website with specifications for all of their accordions at:

http://www.accordions.it/?page=products&lang=EN

The new light weight model is called the Piuma, but it doesnt seem to have a keyboard length listed...
Ben

 

[jarvo]

Helium Balloons ........attached to the strap connector bracket doo hickey thingy .......there's a shedload available now that Jonathon Trappe has given up his Transatlantic Trip !

......right ....er.....I'll get MY coat then..........

 

[simonking]

The wing is compact so it will have small keys, please do not tell me I am looking for something that does not exist, I am going to keep the scandalli, I just want another lighter. probably cheaper accordion that I can carry easily and play along with the scandalli easily

Arent the keys full size on the Wing? It is compact in that there are 37 keys (F-F) instead of 41 (F-A). I did try a second hand one out but didnt think much of the feel or the sound for the amount of money. It is very light though if thats your main concern.

Other ways to keep full size and reduce weight is the get some of the reed blocks taken out - e.g. 2 voice RH and 3-voice LH. But you would still have some of the then unnecessary switching mechanisms and as has been said, much of the weight is in the cabinet.

 

[colinm]

Well lets look at this from another angle , those of you who have more than one accordion, do you swap between them and do you find it easy or difficult

 

[george garside]

the important thing if owning more than one box is to play them all regulary for about the same length of time per day, week or whatever . This also goes for playing different systems eg continental and british chromatic or piano box and Dg melodeon or whatever combination you have. I find this regulary giving them a go means that within minutes of picking up a 'different'' box the fingers etc have automatically adjusted thereto so information about key or button size and spacing must be stored in autopilot being trigures swiftly by the different 'feel' of a box.

george

 

[fjsys]

I agree with george.
When switching between my boxes I always am a little off for the first 15 minutes or so of practice. It comes from the slight differences in how the keyboard feels and how the bass buttons respond.
What I find that slows me down more lately are that the bass buttons respond differently between the four, and the roland 3x bass footprint is smaller so I over jump and mash multiple buttons for the first 15 minutes.

As long as you practice every song that you plan on playing on all of your collection you will adjust rather quickly, but it doesn't mean that you can pick up another accordion and be proficient with it within the same amount of time.

Additionally as a rule if I know I am going to play out I will pick the one that I am going to play out with and use it for at least a week before the gig. This is to make sure that the jumps are correct and avoid the cluster notes.
If I don't know a week before a gig, I will use whichever one I have been favoring that week and be good enough.

I don't feel that I will ever be able to pick one up and be perfect with it without warmup, but that may be just me.

Ben