leather valves again

[epic]

I know this has been talked about before but i have some leather valves starting to curl up, am i better leaving them but would this cause the reed to be out of tune, or if i replace them this can also put it out of tune. I would of thought it would only put the accordion back to how it was what do you all think

 

[wout]

Depends how bad they curled. I would start with flattening them and if that doesnt help replacing Them. Be sure to put the same leather in place as the old one though. In would say it minimizes the chance of the reed sounding detuned

 

[debra]

A bit of curling will not seriously affect tuning as long as the valve really closes when it is "sucked" close. If it stays open when it should close then the frequency will go up. Flattening the valves (remove, then curl the other way, perhaps iron, then glue back with the proper glue) may work for a while (can be years). Replacing the valves by new ones will likely work for longer.

 

[JIM D.]

Before you start - give this a read --
http://www.accordionrevival.com/ACCORDION_REPAIR1.php#changing_reed_leathers

 

[Pipemajor]

A bit of curling will not seriously affect tuning as long as the valve really closes when it is sucked close. If it stays open when it should close then the frequency will go up. Flattening the valves (remove, then curl the other way, perhaps iron, then glue back with the proper glue) may work for a while (can be years). Replacing the valves by new ones will likely work for longer.

I would be interested to know what brand of glue you use Paul, as the ones mentioned by Jim (Indian head gasket varnish. etc) wouldnt be available this side of the pond. I have used Bostic clear glue in the past but dont know if it is ok or suitable :?:

 

[JIM D.]

Bostic clear adhesive will work just fine.

 

[trek4fr]

I've had fairly good results with carefully removing the leathers, ironing them flat, and regluing them with Beacon Fabric-Tac (in the US).

I usually start by sliding a straight-edge Exacto knife between the reed plate and the leather until I encounter resistance. I then mark where the resistance is with a fine point marker on the top of the leather. This way, I don't glue any further along the leather than the original, decreasing the chances that the note will sound out of tune. And most of the leathers will butt up against the rivets on the other end.

Of course, this only works with the external leathers. Leathers inside the reed block are another kind of challenge.

 

[debra]

...
I would be interested to know what brand of glue you use Paul, as the ones mentioned by Jim (Indian head gasket varnish. etc) wouldnt be available this side of the pond. I have used Bostic clear glue in the past but dont know if it is ok or suitable :?:

I dont know what brand it is. I go to a store that sells and repairs clothing, shoes and what not (Volksbelang) and ask them to fill a jar with glue for shoe repair. They poor that out of something like a 5 liter can. They normally do not sell that glue but because I repair accordions they are willing to let me have it. (I got the tip from Henk Vos who taught me some accordion repair skills and who gets his glue there as well.)

 

[geoff45789]

Paul Flannery recommended UHU on the repair course I attended recently

 

[JIM D.]

That shoe repair glue you purchase is sold in small quantities and sold as --
https://www.amazon.com/Barge-All-Pu...8&qid=1507315793&sr=8-1&keywords=barge+cement

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Barge-All-...8&qid=1507315963&sr=1-2&keywords=barge+cement

The advantage of this Barge Cement (shoe glue) is that when dry it will remain resilient and work with both leather and plastic valves. Another advantage is that it can be thinned and removed with --
https://www.amazon.com/Klean-Strip-...F8&qid=1507317324&sr=8-3&keywords=vm&p+naptha

Now there is a clear glue used today with the same properties as Barge Cement (shoe glue) but not yellow but clear --
https://www.amazon.com/Beacon-Fabri...TF8&qid=1507318676&sr=8-1&keywords=fabric+tac
It has the same water resilient and adhesive value but clear and can be used and thinned with naptha.
Both the Shoe type glues and Fabri-tac should be put in a small
container and thinned with naphta as you use it (dries rapidly).
Now as Im typing here (and have time) a few tips --
When you have a reed that is in tune but a with warped leather valve - you can remove the valve - straighten it, or replace it, and if you leave the old residue on the reed plate, and just might use a white glue to replace it.
Now when a outside reed valve is warped, the (inside of the reed block valve may be the same)and need the same attention.
Now with plastic (ventilli) valves (and a reed in tune) you will need to clean off the old glue a reattace a new valve.
And most important, if your doing a replacement, the inside and outside reed valves on a reed, must be of the same quality and size or not sound in in the same in bellows direction .

 

[artelagro]

Interesting thread. There are those who specify the same (or equivalent) adhesives that the previous generation used and others who advocate ‘modern’ glues. Let’s have a list of the actual success or failure stories and the time taken to prove this result. When buying ventile valves, our local supplier CGM Musical recommends the popular brand ( Bostik) because he has found that it doesn’t react with the plastic. I have never seen restrictions re the application for leather valves but am glad that the word shellac is no longer used. After reading the J. Reuther book some years ago I went shopping in Glasgow but no one under the age of 90 had heard of this stuff. Digging deeper I learned that this manual was out of date and fortunately JimD pointed us to the George Bachich website.
To start the ball rolling, I used Evo-Stik contact adhesive on leather valves some 8 years ago and have noticed no ill effects yet.
Garth

 

[epic]

thanks for all your help and advice