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Tips for hand independence?

mitchnc

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I've played piano most of my life, but I'm having a terrible time bringing together both hands on the accordion.

I know a big part of it is because I chose CBA and the treble side is so different from a piano keyboard.
But even when I have the music down pat on the right hand, and the bass part is easy, as soon as I bring them together my brain explodes.

Is there anything specific I can do to remedy this, or just "keep practicing" ?
 
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Nuuksu

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It doesn't matter CBA or PA. It is usual thing for beginners. First learn both parts separately and then start playing them together at slow tempo, don't rush. I recommend to choose simple tune as starting point "Merrily we roll along" should be perfect, melody and bass rhythm are almost same and makes things easyer.
 

george garside

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totally agree re using simple tune and would add 'when the saints go marching in' . Also agree with sorting both ends separately before combining particularly as coming fom a piano to a continental both sides are new to you

george
 

fjsys

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Couple of tips:
1. Try just running the bass hand until it is completely automatic.
2. since you have the right hand down, try to just listen to the bass hand rather than the melody.
3. Keep the songs simple until you get it.
4. Go extremely slowly, but try to keep a steady rhythm. (if you end up with long pauses where you are thinking about what the hands should do, you are going too fast)
5. Count out loud, yell at your self.
6. Get a really loud metronome and put it on the slowest setting.
7. Put the hands together as quick as possible.
8. Don't give up!

Good luck.
Ben
 

xocd

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A different approach learned from my piano teacher is, at the beginning, to think and practice vertically rather than horizontally. That is, think and practice the piece as vertical (as seen on the music page) sequences, or grasps which follow one another. In this approach you start with hands together from the beginning. The horizontal aspects appear after some practice.
 

mitchnc

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Thanks for the thoughts...I will slow down.
For anyone familiar with the Galliano book, I'm up to page 43. They're starting to throw in some chromatics so it's taking even more brain power. :)
I'm also working through Melodic Adventures in Bassland, which I think is helping a lot.
 
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Nuuksu

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Yes dont try to just rush through book - work things out until they feel natural and You are confident when playing them. As I recommended earlier search simple tunes as extra practicing material. I dont know what system CBA You use, still I recommend these books - http://ale07.ru/music/notes/song/bayan/etudy_tehnika.htm These etude books are for B-system CBA.
 
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rancoman

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Oldest trick in the book, and it worked for me mumblemumble years ago - just use a scale with your right hand. C is fine as the principle is the same in any key - it doesn't matter what the note is, it's whether it's up a row or down a row from your last note.

Hold down middle C with your right hand and do a 3/4 bass and chord rythm (C CM CM or oom pah pah) twice with your left hand.

Then move your right hand to D and go up one row to G bass with your left hand and do the same oom pah pah bit.

Then back down to the C row for the E note.

Then down to the F row for F and so on as shown below.

Start very slowly and deliberately, and gradually speed up as the penny drops, which it should do in half an hour tops. After that, everything else is just practice

Sequence is easy - in the key of C major:

C = C bass
D = UP to G bass
E = Down to C bass again
F = Down to F bass
G = Up to C bass again
A - Down to F bass
B = Up two to G bass
C = Back down to C bass again

Do that both up and down the scale with your right hand till you are confident that you know where your left hand is going next when you change note.

Once you can do that comfortably, there is one small obstacle, which is to repeat the same process but in 4/4 time - for some reason the change in tempo with the left hand often gives a little hitch, but it won't last long, and when you can do 3/4 and 4/4, any other tempo just comes easily.

Hope that helps :ch
 

JerryPH

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For me...

1. START SLOW.
2. Start easy, like doing scales independently on both hands, then later together both in the same "direction".
3. Mastery is the result of repetition (LOTS of it!). Take time everyday to spend 20-30 focused, uninterrupted minutes just on this, you will be surprised at how fast things improve in a relatively short amount of time.
4. Raise complexity slowly. When increasing complexity, SLOW DOWN again and build up speed over time.
5. Quality over quantity. Playing fast means little if every 2nd note is a mistake or if you are missing notes.

Just my 2 cents. :)

Later you can add a little more complexity by going in different directions with the hands or starting the scales a 3rd apart. By then, your left hand becomes so independent, you hardly every think about it.

When you can reach a point where you are not thinking about where to put the fingers, as they go where you need them to automatically, and just concentrate on the dynamics and quality of the music, you've pretty much arrived. :)
 

TomBR

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My £0.005 ! Playing with two hands is different! One may be able to play the hands independently quite beautifully, but why wont they go together! Its like filling the basket with apples, then emptying it and filling it with oranges and then being surprised that the apples and oranges wont all fit in the basket!

I think the think vertically is a good idea, go extremely slowly so one can actually think what happens simultaneously and what happens independently.
Fluency with one hand alone is a small part of the whole.

This is my favourite bit of advice on practicing, and it says the most effective practicers put both hands together as early as possible.
http://www.bulletproofmusician.com/8-things-top-practicers-do-differently/[/url]
Good luck!
Tom
 
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rancoman

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That is SO true, Jerry - when you are starting off, you wonder how on earth you will ever be able to get both hands working together - I remember it well.

Then, suddenly it just clicks, and you can do it, and the rest is, as you say, all practice.

After playing for (mumblemumble) years, I truthfully have NO idea what my left hand is doing, it just does it automatically. If I try to do it consciously, say if I'm trying to show someone something by playing it slowly and deliberately, it all goes to pigs and whistles, including my right hand!
 
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geirgramvik

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mitchnc said:
Thanks for the thoughts...I will slow down.
For anyone familiar with the Galliano book, Im up to page 43. Theyre starting to throw in some chromatics so its taking even more brain power. :)
Im also working through Melodic Adventures in Bassland, which I think is helping a lot.

I see in the description of the Galliano book on Amazon that it has fingering for both piano and buttons, but it doesnt say whether the button fingering is for B og C system (using B myself). Any idea which?
 

pentaprism

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geirgramvik said:
I see in the description of the Galliano book on Amazon that it has fingering for both piano and buttons, but it doesnt say whether the button fingering is for B og C system (using B myself). Any idea which?

It is C.
 
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Pianoman1

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Good stuff here I use the David Digiuseppe (sic) book for the left hand as well
Playing piano is deceptive on the PA as you think it will be easy - it is not - I play boogie - stride and jazz piano which mainly has separate left hand parts I think this is what you have to cultivate on the PA by doing lots of left hand only work first
 

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