Question about this Pancordion registers

[ArtMustel]

Hello, I'm looking at a picture of a Pancordion PA model Baton #1358. It is LMMH and it appears to have 4 registers on the treble side, but since I am not familiar with this kind of registers layout I wanted to ask in case you knew what every of the 4 register bars are. For instance, I see one with one mark, so it is bassoon or clarinet or piccolo? Then there is another with 2 marks, probably Violin, one with 3 marks and the one with 4 that should be master. If anyone knows anything about this model registers I will appreciate your help.

 

[Scuromondo]

My guess is that it behaves like the old Excelsior rocker switches, with each switch engaging/disengaging one reed bank only.

 

[ArtMustel]

It could be but then the markings wouldn't make much sense but you might be right. Thank you Scuromondo.
Oh, I just read something about them and I believe you are correct. I was thinking wrongly that the marks referred to 1, 2, 3 or 4 voices but it rather seem to be first mark is for piccolo, 2 marks for Clarinet, 3 marks for Clarinet+ and 4 marks for bassoon, and they work single or combined.

 

[Ventura]

more pics would help...

i personally have never seen a flapper Pan that was not modernized
for the switching assignments, the same as any push shift 3, 5, 7, or 9 type

was it a custom request ? perhaps... i have been told the Flappers were
actually designed and first appeared on New York made Pans, but i have
only ever seen the Myron style (NewYork) Pan in the flesh, with the
voluptuous shift arrangement

so it may be possible it is a very early USA made Pan with a
"similar to excelsior" 4 rocker shift setup

because of the Dating of Italy built Pans (Cruicinelli) it is
difficult to imagine a rocker style setup coming from them

only way to know is open that sucker up

 

[ArtMustel]

There is a youtube video of an accordionist playing a similar instrument, however he made it midi and it won't help much:


I will try to get more pictures of the one I posted, I hope they won't mind me opening it to take pics of the treble and bass reed blocks.

Thank you.

 

[Scuromondo]

There is a youtube video of an accordionist playing a similar instrument, however he made it midi and it won't help much:


I will try to get more pictures of the one I posted, I hope they won't mind me opening it to take pics of the treble and bass reed blocks.

Thank you.

If you physically have access to the accordion, you should not need to open it up, it should be fairly obvious by listening to it in the various switch positions.

 

[ArtMustel]

If you physically have access to the accordion, you should not need to open it up, it should be fairly obvious by listening to it in the various switch positions.

That is right scuoromondo but anyway I am curious about it and wanted to look at the reed and leather condition and take pics of them. Thank you!

 

[nagant27]

These pans are like the 00 excelsior rocker stitches. Usually LMMH where you turn on or off or partially open the slider as desired. A lot of the early USA pans are converted to lmmm but same design. They are really nice accordions and hard to find. I’ve watched videos of Joey miskulin playing them and he seems to be the expert on them and he plays like a boss!

 

[Ventura]

if this is indeed true, then it is a way to identify some American built Pans

and in that case, if you find one and it is not priced out of reach,
definitely get it

personally i tend to think the USA Pans were very seldom equaled
(outside of special orders or custom runs)
by the Italian substitutes

i also feel there are not many to be found in "circulation" anymore

 

[wj2204]

Hello @Ventura. That is actually not the case at all! Pancordions are still being played and used by MANY artists all over the world.
As a matter of fact for anyone interested, check on the "Pancordion Accordions" Facebook page for more knowledge and history on these fine instruments.

 

[JIM D.]

On this one the names explaining the flipper switches are on the UNDERSIDE of the flappers !! With only 4 flipper switches it should
be a 3 reed with a master palm switch. Those 1,2,3,4, markers must have been made by an owner for quick reference. All Pan's had the
shift marking UNDER the flippers. These 3 reed models came in L M H & L M M.

See picture # 7 here -----

USED Pancordion Crucianelli B1 Accordion | Reverb

USED Pancordion Crucianelli B1 Accordion 120 bass 41 treble. Bellows are functioning 100% as they should with no tears or leaks. Made in Italy, comes with hard case.

reverb.com

 

[Scuromondo]

Hello @Ventura. That is actually not the case at all! Pancordions are still being played and used by MANY artists all over the world.
As a matter of fact for anyone interested, check on the "Pancordion Accordions" Facebook page for more knowledge and history on these fine instruments.

I think Ventura meant to highlight the rarity of US-built Pancordions, not Pans in general. My understanding is that the US stopped building Pans sometime in the 1960s (or maybe earlier) and they have been made exclusively in Italy since that time.

While I understand that the Italian Pans are considered excellent instruments, some players still prize the unique sound of those less-common US-built Pans over the Italian ones.

 

[JIM D.]

I see this tread contains some educated guesses , some accurate & some although well meaning, inaccurate. In this tread I have
intended to explain the PAN flipper switch's are not rocker type but operate just like a conventional shift machines with the
nomenclature of purpose UNDER the flippers. These flipper switch machines were well made (built like tanks) and served the
purpose of changing reed voicing without the hand leaving the keyboard. Although some feel they are cosmetically odd they
did and do work well as intended and owners love their ease of use. PAN's had many innovations for their time and I feel more
knowledge is in order.


I'll not take up more space on this tread and start a new one -- "PAN's a brief history. --- Be done shortly.

 

[nagant27]

Jim- aren’t the early ny pans (like the baton or fiesta models) 4 flapper switches each with the dots original like that?
And aren’t they rockers? I’ve never seen these with anything written on the underside, just 1,2,3, or 4 dots on the top.
I am referring to only the American ones.

 

[oldbayan]

Simplest and most effective system! You decide what you want. No need for 13 buttons with duplicates.

 

[JIM D.]

As for the those US models with elongated bars -- they were shifts not rockers. All the Italian made models had the names under the
flippers. The late US firm was only in production with different innovations for a year and a half before the switch to Italian production.
The US firm made models various design features in the beginning that were of different innovations before the PAN models we know
today were finalized.

 

[AccordionUprising]

Not helpful at all ? but I always think those Pancordions look like they have "shark gill" switches. ?

But I've definitely heard they work well.

 

[cheri19977]

I am looking for a panaccordion. this can be an older model 1960 or newer. I played for many years and stopped to have children. I am desperate to find the same accordion that I had. I played concertos mainly and totally enjoyed it.; If you have any knowledge of any please contact me asap.

Thanks,
Cheri Huffsteter
California

 

[Dingo40]

Hi Cheri,
"Liberty Bellows" seem to have some demonstrated on YouTube for sale.
It may be worth contacting them??
See here:

classic pancordion accordion youtube - Google Search

 

[Scuromondo]

I am looking for a panaccordion. this can be an older model 1960 or newer. I played for many years and stopped to have children. I am desperate to find the same accordion that I had. I played concertos mainly and totally enjoyed it.; If you have any knowledge of any please contact me asap.

Thanks,
Cheri Huffsteter
California