opening and closing while sliding my hand

[accordian]

so when the bellows are opening should I be pulling them open or should I be letting gravity do it and when closing how do I go about pushing whilst sliding my hand up or down

thanks

 

[Geronimo]

so when the bellows are opening should I be pulling them open or should I be letting gravity do it and when closing how do I go about pushing whilst sliding my hand up or down

Who is playing the accordion, you or gravity? Its like working the bow on a violin: you do what it takes to maintain the pressure you want to achieve. If gravity has a hand in it as well, you need to compensate for its effect in order to end up with attaining your own goals. If you let gravity take over control, you are not going to be able to change bellows direction without changing tone quality and the tone development will be controlled by gravity rather than you.

I find that a back strap helps to pull the instrument closer to you so that its movements become more of an integral part of you and the bellows an extension of your arms and shoulders. This is not some thing independent from yourself: you are not a juggler but a musician.

 

[accordian]

so when the bellows are opening should I be pulling them open or should I be letting gravity do it and when closing how do I go about pushing whilst sliding my hand up or down

Who is playing the accordion, you or gravity? Its like working the bow on a violin: you do what it takes to maintain the pressure you want to achieve. If gravity has a hand in it as well, you need to compensate for its effect in order to end up with attaining your own goals. If you let gravity take over control, you are not going to be able to change bellows direction without changing tone quality and the tone development will be controlled by gravity rather than you.

I find that a back strap helps to pull the instrument closer to you so that its movements become more of an integral part of you and the bellows an extension of your arms and shoulders. This is not some thing independent from yourself: you are not a juggler but a musician.

Sorry I didn’t explain myself very well

What I mean is how do I slide when opening and closing when opening I let gravity open the bellows so I can move my hand freely but when closing how do I go from eg B to say e flat (I’m not learning a song with this movement just an exaggerated example)

Or perhaps another way to describe it is freely when closing

Thanks

 

[george garside]

sliding the arm through the bass strap is just the same whether opening or closing the bellows but 'jumps' on the bass can usually be done without moving the arm relative to the strap but by articulation of the wrist.
To be able to so articulate requires the hand being well though the strap i.e. the strap should be roughly in the same position as you would wear a watch so the wrist is well clear of the strap.'

As to gravity and pushing there is absolutely no need to take the bellwos out long distances and the further out the less control you have ( some players seem to think it looks 'flash' to wave the bellwos flamboyantly in the wind as if trying to take off!)

My preference is to , most of the time, keep the bellwos fan shaped i.e. more closed at the bottom and exept on rare occasions limit maximum opening to about 18 inches - more control and less strain on the shoulder.

george

 

[Happy girl]

I have just measured 18inches, &, presuming the measurement comes from the centre of the body, the arm is still quite comfortably bent.

It will be interesting to practice this concept with awareness even though I am not guilty of ‘waving the bellows flamboyantly in the wind as if trying to take off’

Any reference to ‘more control, and less strain on the shoulder' is very well received & excellent advice.

Thank you George.

 

[accordian]

sliding the arm through the bass strap is just the same whether opening or closing the bellows but jumps on the bass can usually be done without moving the arm relative to the strap but by articulation of the wrist.
To be able to so articulate requires the hand being well though the strap i.e. the strap should be roughly in the same position as you would wear a watch so the wrist is well clear of the strap.

As to gravity and pushing there is absolutely no need to take the bellwos out long distances and the further out the less control you have ( some players seem to think it looks flash to wave the bellwos flamboyantly in the wind as if trying to take off!)

My preference is to , most of the time, keep the bellwos fan shaped i.e. more closed at the bottom and exept on rare occasions limit maximum opening to about 18 inches - more control and less strain on the shoulder.

george

ok doke but Ive got another question

so if I use the bass strap like a watch rather than something that fits on my hand and rotate my hand then yes I will have a large reach of buttons but same thing when it comes to closing the bellows while my moving my hand up or down as I have a 120 bass accordion.

 

[Geronimo]

so if I use the bass strap like a watch rather than something that fits on my hand and rotate my hand then yes I will have a large reach of buttons but same thing when it comes to closing the bellows while my moving my hand up or down as I have a 120 bass accordion.

The point of a 120 bass accordion is that you need to move less rather than more around than on a 96 or 72 bass accordion: it does not have any bass buttons that the others dont have. It may call the duplications differently (C♯ instead of D♭, for example).

Its quite possible that the root of your problems lies elsewhere in your posture if you feel yourself unable to execute typical jumps without letting go of bellows control.

Do you transmit any bellows force through your fingers? Are you free to play bass notes and chord notes as legato or as detached as you want while playing smooth legato lines on the treble?

 

[accordian]

so if I use the bass strap like a watch rather than something that fits on my hand and rotate my hand then yes I will have a large reach of buttons but same thing when it comes to closing the bellows while my moving my hand up or down as I have a 120 bass accordion.

The point of a 120 bass accordion is that you need to move less rather than more around than on a 96 or 72 bass accordion: it does not have any bass buttons that the others dont have. It may call the duplications differently (C♯ instead of D♭, for example).

Its quite possible that the root of your problems lies elsewhere in your posture if you feel yourself unable to execute typical jumps without letting go of bellows control.

Do you transmit any bellows force through your fingers? Are you free to play bass notes and chord notes as legato or as detached as you want while playing smooth legato lines on the treble?

well when I play I use my palm to close the bellows personally I dont think its about the hand independence part as Im asking about this for the song lambada

I find personally when sitting down its easier as if you stop pushing the bellows closed for a second to slide your hand gravity doesnt pull it back down however when standing I find it quite the opposite Ive read a little about the straps one needing to be longer/looser than the other and I myself have noticed that when Im playing the keyboard will sometimes rotate to my left making more difficult to hit the right note (think I need figure this out) would this make it more difficult though?

what do you mean when you say about letting go of bellows control? do you mean as in just stop pushing completely then slide and continue etc.

 

[george garside]

Its the part of the arm just below the wrist joint, i.e. the position where a watch would be if you were wearing one, that should be through the bellows strap. The strap should be adjusted , assuming there is a rotella to enable adjustment, so that it is reasonably tight i.e. with no noticeable slack on the arm.

The hand has no role in bellows movement which is carried out entirely with the arm positioned as above

If your box is not fitted with a 'rotella' the bass strap can be 'adjusted' by repositioning the retaining screws into new holes in the strap

george

 

[george garside]

I have just measured 18inches, &, presuming the measurement comes from the centre of the body, the arm is still quite comfortably bent.

It will be interesting to practice this concept with awareness even though I am not guilty of ‘waving the bellows flamboyantly in the wind as if trying to take off’

Any reference to ‘more control, and less strain on the shoulder is very well received & excellent advice.

Thank you George.

A useful exercise in bellows control is to play with the bottom bellows strap closed so that the bellows naturally form a fan shape. This is just an exercise for practicing and not recommended for normal playing as there can occasionally by the need for greater bwllows extension in the interests of phrasing particularly if all voices are in use and long bass chords are indicated. The trick is to return the bellows to within 18 inches as soon as possible and keep withn that range of opening as much as possible.

The 18 inches is just a rule of thumb and is approximate. I mentally measure it by keeping a sort of unconscious eye on the top of the bellows . Also when you get used to it the extra arm movement to go beyond 18 inches is felt.

A friend of mine ,a dance band leader, who played 120 bass excelsior and was pretty liberal with the bellows developed severe shoulder problem which he thought would be the end of his box playing. I coached him on minimal movement and once he got the hang of it he played every bit as well as ever without ever having more than 12 inches open and often much less! in fact viewed from behind it looked as if he was playing a Shand Morino rather than a piano box!

george

george

 

[accordian]

I have just measured 18inches, &, presuming the measurement comes from the centre of the body, the arm is still quite comfortably bent.

It will be interesting to practice this concept with awareness even though I am not guilty of ‘waving the bellows flamboyantly in the wind as if trying to take off’

Any reference to ‘more control, and less strain on the shoulder is very well received & excellent advice.

Thank you George.

A useful exercise in bellows control is to play with the bottom bellows strap closed so that the bellows naturally form a fan shape. This is just an exercise for practicing and not recommended for normal playing as there can occasionally by the need for greater bwllows extension in the interests of phrasing particularly if all voices are in use and long bass chords are indicated. The trick is to return the bellows to within 18 inches as soon as possible and keep withn that range of opening as much as possible.

The 18 inches is just a rule of thumb and is approximate. I mentally measure it by keeping a sort of unconscious eye on the top of the bellows . Also when you get used to it the extra arm movement to go beyond 18 inches is felt.

A friend of mine ,a dance band leader, who played 120 bass excelsior and was pretty liberal with the bellows developed severe shoulder problem which he thought would be the end of his box playing. I coached him on minimal movement and once he got the hang of it he played every bit as well as ever without ever having more than 12 inches open and often much less! in fact viewed from behind it looked as if he was playing a Shand Morino rather than a piano box!

george

george

just tried opening only the top strap and that worked although could just be coincidence although to be fair with how far I was opening the bellows im surprised i hadnt made it reach my feet this definitely allows for more consistency where as before when i was opening the bellows my hand movements were much more difficult as the buttons were at complete different angles. as said though this might just be coincidence although seems to be working so far thanks or the help