On the responsibility of accordion sellers to disclose non-A440 tunings

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

Does anyone else find it highly unethical that prominent accordion dealers will sell an instrument tuned to, say, A445 or 435, with lavish descriptions of an accordion's attributes, all while failing to mention that it can't be played with most other instruments? I always make this clear when selling an instrument, understanding that it greatly lowers the value of an otherwise valuable instrument, but have observed that many establishments do not. I personally fell victim to this many years ago, before I knew enough to check. Luckily, my band at the time was, other than me, all string players, and they were stuck tuning up to A445 for the next few years until I could afford another professional quality instrument. An experienced buyer will think to check this, but most people will not. I don't want to name names, but I believe this to be a real problem with some otherwise reputable accordion shops.

 

[Dingo40]

BSA,
Agree with you entirely!
An excellent heads up!

 

[SteveC]

So why would they make an accordion tuned off of 440?

 

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

So why would they make an accordion tuned off of 440?

Concert pitch has varied over time and place. Most older Italian accordions are tuned higher than 440, usually 441 - 446. It's also common for German accordions from the 1930s and earlier to be tuned 432 - 435. If it is 1 or even 2 Hertz off, most people will not notice, except in the highest notes. Any more than that and it becomes untenable.

 

[debra]

It is standard practice among accordion vendors to avoid all mention of tuning frequency. And the reason for this is simple: once they mention a tuning frequency the potential customer gets confused, has no idea what the vendor is talking about, and quickly becomes a non-customer, walking out without buying anything. I think that about 95 of the accordion players I know have no idea that accordions are not all tuned to the same standard frequency (even new accordions), and only find out they cannot play with others after they bought their accordion and cannot return it.
It is part of "sales 101" to not do anything that might confuse the customer, because if you ask a customer for a decision they don't know about they don't buy anything. It's all part of the principle that "making a sale" is more important than "making a customer happy"...

 

[Dingo40]

To me, such a practice would be a breach of the duty of care.
We have a customer protection ordinance here stating an item has to be fit for purpose before it can be sold. It would seem that this rule would also be breached.
But above all, one would think a vendor running a business would want to be a good person and make a friend of their customer: at least that's been my own experience, so far

 

[Gonk]

I don't want to name names, either, but I think that without community feedback, problems can go unchecked.

I think we're talking about a store that:

* Goes for the 'hard sell' (used car lot vibe)
* Inflates prices, pays the absolute minimum for trade-ins, and pushes the more expensive items whenever there's an opportunity
* Is reluctant to disclose what their "restoration" process consists of, especially whether valves or wax have been replaced
* Does not mention non-A440 tunings unless specifically asked, and often says "not sure, we'll have to check"
* Has younger employees doing the meat of the tuning and restoration work, with variable results, high turnover and low pay
* Offers a guarantee but at times tries to avoid honoring it, sometimes by claiming the damage happened after it left the shop

Does this check out?

I agree with you. Anyone in this business, self included, has a responsibility to educate their client -- and in the long run, I think it pays off. We're talking about forming long term relationships within a small community of musicians, not selling some restorative cream and then skipping town with a fake moustache.

 

[Big Squeezy Accordions]

I've always felt that, as accordion technicians/refurbishers/sellers, our job should be to educate the customer so they can make an informed decision, not to exploit their relative lack of knowledge. It's depressing that so many don't seem to feel this way. I recently had a client bring in a small, communist-era Weltmeister that he had bought from a prominent accordion shop for $1200. No work had been done on it, and the wax and leathers were in horrible condition. He could have bought the same accordion in the same condition on ebay from Bulgaria for $300. If I had sold that accordion, I would have replaced the wax and ventiles, done a complete tuning, and still sold it for half what he paid. I'm really not out to toot my own horn, but shouldn't we hold ourselves to some kind of ethical standard?

 

[debra]

Gonk describes the practice of many accordion stores I know. I agree with Big Squeezy Accordions about what accordion sellers *should* do, but sadly the reality of what they actually do is very different.
The main problem for the not so knowledgeable accordion buyer it's hard to find out which are the few accordion sellers that are honest, ask the right questions, provide accurate information on the state of an accordion and the work that was done, and honor the warranty they give. Often the stores with more publicity/advertisements are the stores to avoid. A good accordion seller hardly needs to advertise at all.

 

[Ventura]

for me. personally, my primary approach was always to ask questions of the
customer and try to determine their true needs (not just desires)
then attempt to guide them to a reasonable number of possible
"choices" of instruments (predicated on the concept that i, as an
aware professional, have a vast amount of knowledge to draw from)

if i did my job well, they would choose to buy from the "subset" i
suggested or offered... and not always from "store stock" much to the chagrin
of various employers... because pairing the right instrument with the right person
seems to give the best, longest, and most successful results

this is above specifics like Tuning, because the question and answer period should
have clued me in to the relative importance of something like that and whether it was
germane to the individuals needs or near term future, and i should have made
the selections with that measured in

i found this to be particularly important when a Parent was choosing an instrument
for their child... the young student's needs must be met and exceeded and the instrument must
not only support their studies but inspire them too

i felt the loss of some sales to the competitions 'hard sellers' was offset by the referrals
and upgrade sales i would make over the extended years from satisfied
and even deliriously happy customers

 

[Ffingers]

"...the young student's needs must be met and exceeded and the instrument must
not only support their studies but inspire them too."

Abso-bluddy-lutely!

More damage is done by providing a below standard "learners' instrument" than by any other disincentive to working through the struggles that are necessary for success.

 

[Dingo40]

I still remember my first guitar and guitar teacher who spoke no English!
Put me off guitar forever!

 

[losthobos]

I was gutted to have been sold a bugari once that turned out to bev tuned at 446hz.... beautiful instrument both sound and build wise and luckily I was playing with stringed band at time so they could retune to me every gig....
Sold accordion on pretty quickly and buyer was very happy as he said he'd only be playing alone for his own enjoyment...
Was a pleasure to have owned and as Paul mentioned I probably wouldn't have bought had they told me the tuning was high as at the time I wouldn't have understood the implications...
On a similar note I've a 3x3 bass system chromatic for sale and a couple of buyers have been scared off because,"we don't really know what you're talking about there .." ...which isn't a bad thing as I'd probably have regretted the sale at a later date....pah....fickle me

 

[debra]

I was gutted to have been sold a bugari once that turned out to bev tuned at 446hz.... beautiful instrument both sound and build wise and luckily I was playing with stringed band at time so they could retune to me every gig....
Sold accordion on pretty quickly and buyer was very happy as he said he'd only be playing alone for his own enjoyment...
Was a pleasure to have owned and as Paul mentioned I probably wouldn't have bought had they told me the tuning was high as at the time I wouldn't have understood the implications...
On a similar note I've a 3x3 bass system chromatic for sale and a couple of buyers have been scared off because,"we don't really know what you're talking about there .." ...which isn't a bad thing as I'd probably have regretted the sale at a later date....pah....fickle me

Ah yes, there are so many odd variations in accordion design it would be hard to decide which oddity should really be mentioned to a potential buyer and which is just an "innocent variation" people may not care about and may not even notice as being "different".
Recently someone in a "related" accordion group bought a used Bugari convertor accordion which was sold with the comment that it had Belgian basses but the buyer had no idea what that meant (the bass section looked "normal"). Only later did he discover the bass notes were arranged "upside down" (meaning F above C and G below C in the playing orientation). He only discovered the accordion was tuned 443Hz (and his group has all 440). Not sure why the tuning was not mentioned while the Belgian bass system was mentioned. But it does show people don't know what things mean.
I started out with the 3x3 bass system and later switched to 2x4. I would not be put off by either, but I can imagine it would be an issue for some.
And one time I was gifted an old 80 bass clunker, just not bad enough to dismantle for reusable parts, and it turned out to have "full" 7th chords (so all 4 notes in each chord) making it impossible to reuse the 7th as a diminished for the next note. Luckily I knew how to change that... I'm sure the previous owner never new there was something "odd" about the 7th chords on his accordion.