Need Help Identifying these Old Accordions

[Irisiy17]

Hey All!

I found this forum recently and was hoping to draw upon your extensive knowledge to help me identify a few accordions that I have found while doing research in Jordan. These accordions all belonged to Circassians from the Caucasus, a people who were displaced in 1864 and taken in by the Ottoman Empire. They were collected by a private owner over the 20th century in Amman. The owner is quite old and says the oldest accordion in the glass case was played by his grandmother around 1900.

Any thoughts? Thank you in advance!

Also, if any has additional knowledge or expertise in the traditional music of the Caucasus region, I would like to speak with you! Please consider sending me a private message.

 

[maugein96]

Hi,

I think you might struggle to have those accordions identified by members on here. If you can identify the military uniforms worn by the two men in the bottom picture, that might be a clue.

The top photo shows (from left to right as you look at the photo) a garmon, a Russian style bayan, and a small piano accordion. The others I have absolutely no idea at as to what they are or where they come from. At a guess all three instruments would have been manufactured in the former USSR, but the garmon is of a style Ive never seen before.

There is one forum member who has done research on the instruments found in the former USSR, and he may be able to give you further info. If he doesnt pick up on this his user name is morne, and it may be worth sending him a Personal Message.

Only Caucasian music Ive ever really heard is so called Azeri from Azerbaijan, but Azeri music nowadays covers everything from traditional music to jazz and even pop. They do play garmons similar to the one in the photo, but Azerbaijan is a bit further east from where the Circassians lived, according to any maps Ive seen.

EDIT:- Had a dig on You Tube and found this clip of an instrument called a Pshine, which is the one I couldnt identify in the top photo. Will need to brush up on my Cyrillic Script to try and find out more about the music without getting side tracked into other styles from neighbouring parts of the Caucasus.


Seems the Adyge people ended up all over the place, but keep the musical tradition going wherever they are. This clip is from Turkey, and if you check the facebook link youll find some other Circassian music there.



Also check this guy out playing on Volna TV Channel from Russia (Black Sea area)

 

[maugein96]

Yet another clip showing men dressed in more or less identical attire to the soldiers in the bottom photo.

A truly fascinating style encompassing various accordion types. Pity we cant identify the makers of any of the accordions (or whatever they are known as in the various Circassian dialects)


An elderly female, Abida Omar, playing a small piano accordion in Jordan. Apparently shes the best known player of Circassian music there?

 

[Irisiy17]

Thank you for your posts.

The Circassians in Jordan are largely comprised of the Adighe people from the Caucasus, although the Abkhazians, Ossetians, and Dagestanis, and other smaller groups also get lumped in with them in the diaspora. They were forced out of Russia initially in 1864 and spread throughout the Ottoman Empire. It's estimated that their numbers today are in the millions in the diaspora, largely centered in Turkey, Jordan, Europe, and the USA. (Some have been doubly displaced from the Balkans, Palestine, and Syria over time.)

The primary instrument of the music today (since the late 1800s) is the accordion, although it is not a part of their original collection of folk instruments. Since they were expelled from Russia, it is possible many of them would have been acquiring accordions from different places depending on their sites of displacement, whether it be the USSR, Istanbul, Balkans, Damascus, or other places in Europe. So there are many different kinds in use throughout their history. I have heard them referred to as Garmon, Harmonika, Bayan, and accordion.

The word "Pshine" is not a type of accordion, it's just a generic term for instrument that came to be synonymous with the accordion. A player of the Pshine is know as the Pshinawa. (Pshine in Circassian literally means "blowing in the hole" according to one of my sources)

And yes, Abida Omar is the "Queen of Circassian Music." She is a very important figure in my research for her role of maintaining and creating Circassian music in Jordan throughout the mid-late 20th century. Due to radio and a few recordings, she is a revered figure amongst the Circassians in Jordan and well-known in other diaspora sites and in the homeland.

Thanks again

 

[maugein96]

Hi,

Thanks for that clear explanation regarding the Circassians. I had never previously heard of the music, although knew that the accordion was a popular instrument in the Caucasus area. I obviously misinterpreted the meaning of "pside" in Wiki.

Can you possibly enlighten me as to whether the clip I posted of Marat Gabanov on Russian TV is representative of present day Circassian music, or did I get that one wrong too? It is my understanding that some Circassian people were in fact able to return to the Black Sea area in the 20th century, and possibly revived the music? It is a very uplifting style of playing, whatever it is.


Thanks again.

 

[Morne]

maugein96s got the general idea. Ive added the Russian spellings of things in case you want to search for more images or videos. If you have specific questions, let me know and I can try to search for more information. I am not an expert on these slightly more exotic instruments, though.

The specific models in your first photo, from left to right:

• The first one is a kind of garmon. It was made by the Kazan factory. The letters on the front wouldve read: Казань (Kazan)
  Example: You can search for more photos/videos using: Гармонь Казан
  As for type of garmon, Ive seen it being referred to as both a Tatar Garmon and a Talyanka Garmon.
• The second instrument is a bayan. The specific brand is Sarmat (Сармат).
  Example: Search more: Баян Сармат
• The third one is a piano accordion, with the brand Malysh (Малыш). This was meant as a childs accordion.
  Example: Search more: Аккордеон малыш

The 2 instruments in the next photos are older but I believe would also fall in that Tatar/Talyanka family. The lever-like system on the left hand was used by older (ancient!) accordions back in the day (like closer to the early 1900s).
They seem similar to another type known as Yeletskaya Royalnaya Garmon (Елецкая рояльная гармонь). Example:
I used to listen to some music from the Caucasus before I started playing accordion. Its modern but with the Caucasus style of accordion. Here are some singers I recall:
Murat Thagalegov: Magomed Dzybov: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6L2cDHFDTDI
Azamat Bishtov: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2-c2h4thlM
(It was all very confusing at first when I saw the Cyrillic but the words all looked garbled, until I learnt some of what I was looking at wasnt Russian!)
I dont know whether they are popular, or represent a certain style or what not.

I dont remember what else I knew about the music from the area, but I know a popular dance there is called Lezginka.

 

[Morne]

Yet another clip showing men dressed in more or less identical attire to the soldiers in the bottom photo.

John, the Kuban Cossacks adopted a similar style of coats. Here they are singing in a choir with the Russian garmon and bayan:

An interesting feature on those coats is those distinctive tubes on the front. From what I understood, historically those were used to store gunpowder cartridges for muskets or some similar rifles.

 

[maugein96]

An interesting feature on those coats is those distinctive tubes on the front. From what I understood, historically those were used to store gunpowder cartridges for muskets or some similar rifles.

Hi Morne,

I can confirm they are cartridge pouches. Thats about all I know though. Id a good idea you would be able to identify the boxes and those Kuban Cossacks certainly know how to stir an audience.

I had heard Azeri music in Turkey which was also a very pleasant change from the usual fare, but has more of an oriental twang to it than Circassian. The Turks loved it.

(sorry, this is actually Armenian/Georgian, not Azeri)

(this is Azeri) Easy to get them mixed up, but not if youre Azeri, apparently. Worse when the accordionist is actually a Bulgarian, but never mind.

Talking of Cossacks. here are some from Ossetia.

 

[AccordionUprising]

This is why I come here: a whole new kind of accordion to me!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge!

 

[maugein96]

Bruce,

The OP rekindled a lot of memories of listening to music from the Caucasus region. I first heard music from the area played by Azerbaijani people living in Turkey, and I tried to find out a lot more about it, with not a lot of success in pre internet days.

The term Caucasian probably doesnt conjure up much in the minds of most Westerners, referring to a multicultural mountainous area which separates Europe from Asia. There is a very strong Russian influence in some of the area from the old USSR days. Ive never been to the area, as my UK military service restricted me from travel to that particular part of the world for many years, and the region is now regarded by the travel gurus as one of the most dangerous places on earth, so I might just pass on it altogether. Even today member states and countries are still at odds with each other.

We UK cops used to laugh when our counterparts on American TV said they were looking for a Male white Caucasian, as in Scotland that would mean an Asian man with coloured skin, but with white genitals! We never used the term by virtue of the fact it was deemed to be politically incorrect over here. All Caucasians are apparently classed as white, but not all white people are Caucasian. Therefore it would be unfair to suggest that a very high percentage of our crime was committed by Caucasian people. A classic case of political correctness which was relevant in one English speaking country but not another. Dont know if you use the term in Canada, but I dont suppose it really matters. Those members of my family who emigrated to the US were called Scotch-Irish, a term that is unknown to either Scottish or Irish people, but which I suppose covered yet another race of people from mixed genetic pools.

Anyway, I thought Id draw attention to another amusing little coincidence where innocent use of the English language relative to the Caucasus verges on creating certain issues.

The Russians refer to certain dances in the Caucasus as Lezginka, from the Lezgin peoples found in area, and somebody decided that the English translation of their language should be Lezgian. People who visit the area are encouraged to be able to speak Russian, but some knowledge of Lezgian may also be desirable.

Here is modern Lezginka music on accordion. Fortunately there are no lyrics involved which could be misconstrued by English speakers!

Cavagnolo bayans, of course!

 

[Morne]

(sorry, this is actually Armenian/Georgian, not Azeri)

(this is Azeri) Easy to get them mixed up, but not if youre Azeri, apparently. Worse when the accordionist is actually a Bulgarian, but never mind.

Thats a rabbit hole I havent gone down. Im sure there are clear differences once one pays close attention, but right now Im happy just knowing it collectively as Caucasian and that it is different to the usual fare. And thats why I like it.

Ever since I came across music from the Caucasus, and learnt about the real Caucasians, Ive thought the racial usage was odd. At least it never involved a white-membered Asian... But this is getting off-topic, so Ill leave that for another day.

 

[maugein96]

Thats a rabbit hole I havent gone down. Im sure there are clear differences once one pays close attention, but right now Im happy just knowing it collectively as Caucasian and that it is different to the usual fare. And thats why I like it.

Ever since I came across music from the Caucasus, and learnt about the real Caucasians, Ive thought the racial usage was odd. At least it never involved a white-membered Asian... But this is getting off-topic, so Ill leave that for another day.

Morne,

I started delving into it a bit and discovered various pretty nasty remarks on some You Tube clips (using Google translate), inferring that certain music had been stolen from one Caucasian state/country by another. I found a pretty good Armenian guy playing Azeri music on a garmon, and had actually posted it as Azerbaijani music. However, when I checked the dialling code of the country where the player was based, it was 374 (Armenia) so I thought it was wiser to remove the clip in case I offended anybody. Like yourself I like it all, but am now hesitant to post clips in case I make a major error in identification. I have an unfortunate habit of making broad statements about various music styles, based on a little knowledge, and I havent a single tin hat left without at least one hole in it!