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Leaky bellows

Sunshinexxx

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I watched a few videos on leaky bellows and how to avoid them. Also how to check if they leak or not.
....changing direction after musical phrases instead of within mid measure are one of them to avoid them from going leaky.

I searched specifically the tune LA Donna E Mobile on you tube where other ppl change direction within the tune. Everyone does it at different times. Some do it mid measure.

My question is: Has it something to do with the size of the accordion, like smaller accordions needing more and bigger ones less air?
If I don't change direction my keys or bass dont make a sound after a longer phrase.

2. Also what is your best way of checking if your accordion has got leaky bellows.

Thanks
 
It is simple physics that if the bellows are wider and taller they will shift more air for the same inch of movement in or out than one with a smaller bellows cross section. So a larger accordion will have more air capacity from opening or closing.

How much air is needed is also related to the quality and voicing of the reeds. Poor quality reeds with wide tolerances can use much more air to sound. When your moving air through more reeds at a time it will also take more.

Bellows are one place the instrument can leak. They can also leak from insufficient sealing of the valves that keep the notes closed when not playing. A well sealed accordion should not open too easily when no notes are being played. There is a test you can do to see how many seconds it takes for gravity to pull the bellows open, but I think for most of us it comes down to knowing the feel for a decently sealed accordion and what’s acceptable to the player. I’ve known pros that used vintage instruments professionally that were a lot less efficient than I would tolerate for my casual playing at home.

I don’t know how much I buy the comment about changing direction mid phrase will contribute to damage to the bellows. It just keeps the phrase your playing sound smooth, there are entire styles of playing where changing the bellows direction rapidly back and forth is required. Letting components of the instrument dry out, or not following proper procedures when disassembly or reassembly of the instrument will cause a loss in sealing much faster. I would much rather have an instrument that was occasionally played robustly and serviced when necessary than one that had sat for years unplayed.
 
Hi Sunshine!

I don’t believe changing your bellows mid measure will make them go leaky. The “bellows police” might diss you for this practice but I say, “Don’t worry, be happy.” As you play more, you will settle into a bellows changing method that works for You.

As far as checking, try closing and/or opening the bellows without pressing any keys, buttons or air release valve. If it’s super easy to close and open, then your bellows leak bad. If it’s hard to impossible, your bellows do not leak. The amount of pressure required indicates the “leakiness.” It an acquired skill, you’ll get used to it.

And yes, a smaller accordion will take in and out less air, so it will seem that bellows changes have to occur more frequently, but much is up to the player.

As to what causes bellows leak, there are 3 main causes (but not exclusively).

1. There is a leak in the gasket that goes between the bellows wood and the frame of the accordion. This is most common (in my experience) and is generally an “easy” fix by replacing the gasket. Finding a new one is the hardest part.

2. There is one or more loose or damaged bellows corner (metal) that allows air to leak out. More difficult repair.

3. The bellows paper itself is ripped. Can be repaired by covering the leak with bellows tape as a temporary repair.

But beware that not all symptoms of “bellows leak” are from the bellows. Air can escape (leak) from other conditions, such as leather valves that don’t fit properly. It will take a little ciphering to determine just what is going on and I wish you the best of luck.
 
I watched a few videos on leaky bellows and how to avoid them. Also how to check if they leak or not.
....changing direction after musical phrases instead of within mid measure are one of them to avoid them from going leaky.
A bit of a fallacy there... leaky bellows don't fix themselves mid measure... if they leak, they leak ALL THE TIME, in and lout.

I searched specifically the tune LA Donna E Mobile on you tube where other ppl change direction within the tune. Everyone does it at different times. Some do it mid measure.
I find that most people don't pay attention to bellows direction and change when they run out of air one direction or arm length in the other. Some change directions in the middle of a musical phrase, which can mean at the end of the measure or somewhere in the middle. The concept is to not HEAR a bellows change happen in a manner that you cut notes with it.

My question is: Has it something to do with the size of the accordion, like smaller accordions needing more and bigger ones less air?
If I don't change direction my keys or bass dont make a sound after a longer phrase.
2. Also what is your best way of checking if your accordion has got leaky bellows.
Most definitely the volume of air in a bellows has a lot to do with how long you can play before needing to change direction. If you are not getting the notes to start right after a direction change it could be technique or it could be slow responding reeds.

The best tool to check for leaking air is a tool that you already have. ;)
The lips of your mouth are extremely sensitive and can feel even the tiniest leaks and you will also likely hear some leaks too. Place the accordion on someone else and have them create pressure in the bellows (push pretty but don't go nuts... lol). You move your head around key areas like around where the bellows and body of the accordion meet. Feel AND LISTEN for air movement, you will spot them easy enough.

EDIT: Seems that Tom AND Ben answered before I could finish... lol
 
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A bit of a fallacy there... leaky bellows don't fix themselves mid measure... if they leak, they leak ALL THE TIME, in and lout.


I find that most people don't pay attention to bellows direction and change when they run out of air one direction or arm length in the other. Some change directions in the middle of a musical phrase, which can mean at the end of the measure or somewhere in the middle. The concept is to not HEAR a bellows change happen in a manner that you cut notes with it.


Most definitely the volume of air in a bellows has a lot to do with how long you can play before needing to change direction. If you are not getting the notes to start right after a direction change it could be technique or it could be slow responding reeds.

The best tool to check for leaking air is a tool that you already have. ;)
The lips of your mouth are extremely sensitive and can feel even the tiniest leaks and you will also likely hear some leaks too. Place the accordion on someone else and have them create pressure in the bellows (push pretty but don't go nuts... lol). You move your head around key areas like around where the bellows and body of the accordion meet. Feel AND LISTEN for air movement, you will spot them easy enough.

EDIT: Seems that Tom AND Ben answered before I could finish... lol
Thank you for your detailed reply. I did NOT mean that they would fix themselves if one changes direction at the end of musical phtases. I meant to avoid them getting leaky one has to probably go more with the natural flow instead of trying to squeeze the air out in abrupt ways.

Thank you also for answering how you test them if they are leaky. Also about concept of not to hear them change.

Thanks again. All stuff to think and implement.
🙂
 
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Hi Sunshine!

I don’t believe changing your bellows mid measure will make them go leaky. The “bellows police” might diss you for this practice but I say, “Don’t worry, be happy.” As you play more, you will settle into a bellows changing method that works for You.

As far as checking, try closing and/or opening the bellows without pressing any keys, buttons or air release valve. If it’s super easy to close and open, then your bellows leak bad. If it’s hard to impossible, your bellows do not leak. The amount of pressure required indicates the “leakiness.” It an acquired skill, you’ll get used to it.

And yes, a smaller accordion will take in and out less air, so it will seem that bellows changes have to occur more frequently, but much is up to the player.

As to what causes bellows leak, there are 3 main causes (but not exclusively).

1. There is a leak in the gasket that goes between the bellows wood and the frame of the accordion. This is most common (in my experience) and is generally an “easy” fix by replacing the gasket. Finding a new one is the hardest part.

2. There is one or more loose or damaged bellows corner (metal) that allows air to leak out. More difficult repair.

3. The bellows paper itself is ripped. Can be repaired by covering the leak with bellows tape as a temporary repair.

But beware that not all symptoms of “bellows leak” are from the bellows. Air can escape (leak) from other conditions, such as leather valves that don’t fit properly. It will take a little ciphering to determine just what is going on and I wish you the best of luck.
Thank you for your detailed answers.
It's all very interesting and more complex.
What causes etc
All stuff and something to think about and implement 🙂
 
It is simple physics that if the bellows are wider and taller they will shift more air for the same inch of movement in or out than one with a smaller bellows cross section. So a larger accordion will have more air capacity from opening or closing.

How much air is needed is also related to the quality and voicing of the reeds. Poor quality reeds with wide tolerances can use much more air to sound. When your moving air through more reeds at a time it will also take more.

Bellows are one place the instrument can leak. They can also leak from insufficient sealing of the valves that keep the notes closed when not playing. A well sealed accordion should not open too easily when no notes are being played. There is a test you can do to see how many seconds it takes for gravity to pull the bellows open, but I think for most of us it comes down to knowing the feel for a decently sealed accordion and what’s acceptable to the player. I’ve known pros that used vintage instruments professionally that were a lot less efficient than I would tolerate for my casual playing at home.

I don’t know how much I buy the comment about changing direction mid phrase will contribute to damage to the bellows. It just keeps the phrase your playing sound smooth, there are entire styles of playing where changing the bellows direction rapidly back and forth is required. Letting components of the instrument dry out, or not following proper procedures when disassembly or reassembly of the instrument will cause a loss in sealing much faster. I would much rather have an instrument that was occasionally played robustly and serviced when necessary than one that had sat for years unplayed.
Thank you for your input.
There is probably a difference in how the accordion is played as much as the quality of the accordion to start with.
The seconds test shows that my accordion might be 'leaky' but I never did that test when it was new. I have changed direction quite abruptly in the past and I am more careful now.
A subject that continues to be interesting for me as the opinions and views on the matter vary. I have no other accordion to compare it with. That's why it's great to have all of you responding so quickly and with different views on a very big part of what makes the accordion what it is: The bellows. One of the prettiest and most interesting feature of the instrument.

Thank you everyone for your response.🙏
 
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and a bit extra

if you look at many accordions, you might notice some
bellows designs have DEEPER cardboard "folds" and larger
metal bellows corners

any accordion can be customized with adding 2 or a few
extra bellows folds, or if ordering a new bellows (or new accordion)
simply request a couple more folds.. it's your money and they want it !

you (almost) can never go wrong carefully putting on
new/fresh bellows gasket tape around the perimeter
to tighten things up a bit
 
and a bit extra

if you look at many accordions, you might notice some
bellows designs have DEEPER cardboard "folds" and larger
metal bellows corners

any accordion can be customized with adding 2 or a few
extra bellows folds, or if ordering a new bellows (or new accordion)
simply request a couple more folds.. it's your money and they want it !

you (almost) can never go wrong carefully putting on
new/fresh bellows gasket tape around the perimeter
to tighten things up a bit
Thank you. That makes sense! Extra bellow folds. Thanks again!
 
you (almost) can never go wrong carefully putting on
new/fresh bellows gasket tape around the perimeter
to tighten things up a bit
Easy to do and frequently needed to some degree or other in older instruments.

Agree with that word "almost" as well. six or seven years ago I spent quite some time repairing the damage wrought by an enthusiastic, fearless, intrepid, and ignorant, gentleman who had "his grandfathers accordion from the garage". The reeds were rusty and crud laden though they made sounds and the valves resembled Fritos but he brought it to me because his gasket replacement had ganged aglee and my irritating afternoon noisemaking on the front porch with the denizens of my own accordion ranch gave him the illusion I might be able to help him.

He had managed to get ahold of 5mm thick foam gasket tape- thicker must be better, right? He had applied it fairly neatly including around the corners but, to nobody who has any experience's surprise, the foam was so thick that the case just didn't come close to allowing the holes for the pins to align. (2mm would have been good in this case- 3mm if you really pushed it and prayed while squeezing and inserting the pins.)

He had really leaned in on the keyboard side (fortunately he had done that side first and had not yet gotten around to the bass side) and when the pins just would not go he had "helped" them in with a few judicious taps from a hammer.

They went into and split the wood frame causing me to squander quite some time redrilling holes just off from the originals (a bit of a pain), repairing the wood (wood glue and plastic wood) and then redoing the gasket (a fifteen minute process if you're slow). Since I did nothing whatsoever to the reeds and valves other than blowing off the crud with compressed air- it remained a cacaphonous party toy.

But a beloved, sentimental, cacaphonous party toy for the owner.
 
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I would love to find out more about it. Sounds like you know the insides of an accordion.
Thanks for sharing ☺️
 
Some experience- but in any depth mostly with other types of instruments. On accordion's mechanics I'm somewhat comfortable but by no stretch truly competent.

Thanks for the compliment nonetheless.
 
....changing direction after musical phrases instead of within mid measure are one of them to avoid them from going leaky.
That advice is on a level with the one from not touching yourself in order not to go blind. In short, it seems like a desparate invention from somebody wanting to change your habits while not having a convincing reason why.

There are reasons to avoid changing bellows mid-phrase iff it can be avoided (once you are playing polyphonic pieces where notes in different voices don't do you the favor of ending at the same time, you'll have to work overtime to avoid changing bellows mid-note). This is not one of them.

Checking for a leaky bellows is usually done by putting your accordion on its feet, setting registers to master left and right, lifting the treble part up as far as it would reasonably go while playing while sounding notes, then stop sounding any notes and let it sink back down (guided) and see how long it takes. Results depend on the kind of instrument but a typical large instrument will take about a minute to deflate without notes in play under the weight of its treble part.
 
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