No wax used but gasket
#1
I was shown an accordion. In that accordion wax was not used to attach the reed plates to the blocks. A length of gasket was placed between the reed plates and the blocks. This is a rare practice, isn't it? I would say this would not be as air-tight as when wax is used.

In the picture below, "A" points to a gasket between the block and the base. "B" points to where wax is not used.

Any comments? Thanks!


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#2
Nailed in plates... Common for french models... Piermaria... Maugein... Great sound... Too bright for some... I love it... I don't get all freaked outnleaving accordion in the sun when playing outdoors...
Right or wrong make it strong...when in doubt miss it out...
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#3
As losthobos said this is common in french models. It is also the standard way to seal between reed plates and block in Russian bayans.
Also, higher-end Italian accordions now use large multi-reed plates on the bass side and there too a (leather) gasket is used.
I have worked on a Piermaria with nailed in reed plates. There is absolutely no problem in the seal between reed plate and reed block.
What is strange in the photo is that there appears to be an extra seal between the reed block and the base plate. It could be that a repairer had problems with that seal and instead of the proper fix just added an extra gasket.
Paul De Bra (not Debra...)
http://www.de-bra.nl
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#4
Thank you losthobos and Paul! Very helpful information.

Yes Paul, a seal between the block and base plate is tere. I may ask about it further.

Thanks!
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#5
(04-12-2019, 04:46 PM)James Wrote: Thank you losthobos and Paul! Very helpful information.

Yes Paul, a seal between the block and base plate is tere. I may ask about it further.

Thanks!

The reason I noticed this and found it strange is that it is not normal to have an extra seal between the reed block and its base. There is already a seal between these in every accordion (typically leather), and this should be sufficient. But... if the reed block or the base isn't perfectly straight then the block may not be sealed properly onto the base.  Also, the reed block is "clamped" (forced) onto the base on both ends. if it isn't tight (if you can wiggle it slightly) it needs tightened (on both ends). It must be possible to obtain a perfect seal this way. Adding an extra gasket should not be needed but an inexperienced repair person may not fully realize this try to improve the seal by adding an extra gasket, thereby reducing how vibrations in the reed block get transferred to the base.
Paul De Bra (not Debra...)
http://www.de-bra.nl
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#6
Yes, there is normally a very thin layer of felt-like material attached to the bottom of block, which serves as a seal between the block and the base. As that felt-like material is the equal size of the bottm surface, you do not normally see it. But in this accordion you do see the (extra) "seal", which is not normal.
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#7
(Yesterday, 01:17 AM)James Wrote: Yes, there is normally a very thin layer of felt-like material attached to the bottom of block, which serves as a seal between the block and the base. As that felt-like material is the equal size of the bottm surface, you do not normally see it. But in this accordion you do see the (extra) "seal", which is not normal.

James,

Cavagnolo now pin/nail the reeds directly onto the reed blocks without the use of either cork or leather. They have developed a way to engineer the reed blocks so that no seal is required. 

The big wax vs no wax argument has been on the go for a very long time. The waxers claim the reeds stay in tune longer and the nailers say it doesn't matter, as the reeds are easier removed and replaced if necessary. 

The difference in tone between the two methods is the thing that really matters, although I had been playing French made instruments for about 15 years before somebody explained it all to me, so I was none the wiser.
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#8
I'm under the impression there's really no perceptible difference in tone.

I mean, for sure there will be perceptible differences in tone between the accordions, but principally because of their reeds. If you pulled the reeds out of an accordion and cleaned the wax off, laid down a nice leather gasket with matching holes, and did a clean job of nailing the reeds back in, no one would know but you. That isn't part of what generates the tone - those parts just need to be made out of substances like basswood and aluminum that can be easily milled, and attached so they don't leak air. Such has been my impression.

It's interesting to hear that there's an extra layer of something, other than just the leather surface. I thought it was just that one layer of leather between the metal and the wood.
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#9
There's a huge difference in tone.... I played a guest piece at Eastbourne Accordion Festival some time back and two people came and asked afterwards why my accordion sounded so different to all the others.. I explained it was because I'm a shite player....
However if i practice tap dance on a corked tap floor it sounds different to my normal laminate flooring and certainly mellower than tapping out a few riffs on the tin roof of my Honda Jazz...
Right or wrong make it strong...when in doubt miss it out...
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